I've been playing priest a lot lately; losing to fatigue warrior. And I was just imagining what tools the class could get to compete with fatigue; and this is what I came up with. I really like the idea of Non-Traditional Weapons for the'caster' classes; just looking for input and others ideas! Chose the Vanilla WoW class quest weapon for priest, it's a classic.
It seems like a fascinating concept to have an infinite weapon, however if you're seriously going for the 3 mana it might be a bit too powerful. 3 mana to give a major boost to your hero power every once in a while a decent boost the rest of the time doesn't seem like that much of an investment for such a powerful effect. That's just my take on it, good idea!
First card I ever created, and this makes it much better; thanks for the input. I'm also toying with Anathema being a 0/4 as well and just acting like shadow form. So it's a 3 mana card that acts like shadowform but lets you revert back to healing. And with your text @agithore on benediction it could have synergy with the shadowform card.
It seems like a fascinating concept to have an infinite weapon, however if you're seriously going for the 3 mana it might be a bit too powerful. 3 mana to give a major boost to your hero power every once in a while a decent boost the rest of the time doesn't seem like that much of an investment for such a powerful effect. That's just my take on it, good idea!
My reasoning for it being 3 mana is that it takes 4 turns of using a low value hero power to set up for the high value hero power. If it was 7 mana like gorehowl, it would be turn 12 before you could actually do anything with it. But I'm not expert on balance so I completely threw 3 mana out there. Because with 3 mana you can use the anathema effect on turn 8 at the earliest (excluding garrison commander shenanigans).
You definitely should use the Inspire keyword. And remember that the inspire text will activate together with your hero power, and not replace it. The suggestion:
"Benediction: Inspire: Your Hero gains +2 Health. Lose 1 Durability. Deathrattle: Equip a 0/1 Anathema."
If used in your hero, will have a boost of 4 health, which may be too much.
Increasing the max health of the hero is certainly stronger. It's also unique, but I would say 3 mana would still be fair. The weapon does nothing for tempo for a min of 4 turns. Yes it gives increased value to the HP but not permanently.
With 2 of these in a fatigue priest, along with justicar, you could achieve 46 max health and realistically escape all but the biggest burst decks.
Also considering making there be no deathrattle on anathema for balance, but it does limit the health gain to 46. Which I think is still solid for what this card is attempting to do.
My assumption given the mechanics, is that the deathrattle would overwrite the weapon given by blingtron. Bling's weapon destroys Benediction, then Anathema overwrites Bling's weapon.
Is it really that hard to click the 5th button on the right? If you don't include your cards in the post you make baby Sylvanas cry.
Also, Keep. It. Simple. Benediction: 3 mana 1/4. "Inspire: Restore 2 Health to your hero."
Anathema... Uh what? Does this turn the Priest hero power into a "Destroy an enemy minion"!? And if I wanted that, wouldn't I just put Shadow Word: Death in my deck instead?
Well, if you notice this is my first thread ever; so thanks for the tip!
And my idea is not to have the weapon be used to attack (following the lines of Warcraft where caster's use their weapons to channel magic, rather than use them in melee combat), so 0/4 over 1/4.
Also "Inspire: Restore 2 Health" isn't the cards intent, the intent is to give you the ability to heal over the maximum of 30 much like warrior's armor; the effect is akin to Power Word: Shield for your hero. And Anathema is simply a by product of Benediction, like Ashbringer is to Tirion Fordring.
Regarding Shadow Word: Death it is weaker than Anathema. Anathema's effect will kill any minion and not something that is just over 5 attack i.e. Ysera.
Te concept is a great idea. I think each class should have weapons and secrets for sure. They can benefit the class such as a 0-1 damage Mage weapon that increases spell power or similar for healing with priests, but every class uses weapons in WoW, so why not add them to HS?
the same for secrets. Each class should have a trick or two up their sleeves like for warrior they could have (for lack of a better word) under-armor or something like that.
Classes with a proficiency in weapons or secrets still have an advantage but it's something each should have available.
I feel like there's a good idea there with "under-armor" lol. Warrior secrets that trigger when the opponent breaks through your armor. May give a warrior deck a reason to not try to get to 40 armor while still protecting your life total.
And my idea is not to have the weapon be used to attack (following the lines of Warcraft where caster's use their weapons to channel magic, rather than use them in melee combat), so 0/4 over 1/4.
Also "Inspire: Restore 2 Health" isn't the cards intent, the intent is to give you the ability to heal over the maximum of 30 much like warrior's armor; the effect is akin to Power Word: Shield for your hero. And Anathema is simply a by product of Benediction, like Ashbringer is to Tirion Fordring.
Regarding Shadow Word: Death it is weaker than Anathema. Anathema's effect will kill any minion and not something that is just over 5 attack i.e. Ysera.
You have a point about Warcraft weapons. However, I think Hearthstone should stand on its own. We already have casters smacking stuff with weapons (Shaman, thoughtstealing priests, Blingtron...) so I feel that in the context of this game, weapons should always have at least 1 attack, even staffs.
I'm also not a fan of effects that go on and on and on until the opponent counters it. They exist in Hearthstone (Dreadsteed comes to mind) but there is a serious cost penalty to it. I understand that you wanted to mimic the effect of the item in World of Warcraft, but you chose one that's really tricky to make into a good Hearthstone card. There are just too many issues with it.
I have a good feeling for Hearthstone card design. The whole point of this post though is to think of Non-Traditional Class Weapons and have a discussion. And in regards to your presented issues they are easily answered.
"- No other card can increase a hero's health above 30 - is this really good for the game?"
There are plenty of cards that do that Armorsmith, Shieldmaiden, Bash, Shield Block, Ice Barrier, Claw, and Bite. Along with the Warrior Class's natural hero powers Armor Up! andTank Up! same with Druid's Shapeshift and Dire Shapeshift it's already in the game in the form of Armor (healing with no limit); and this card simulates that effect. Just looking for a more class appropriate mechanic, though Armor could easily be used as a substitute. It's just that this effect let's priest use a card like Priestess of Elune to recoup health over 30 if at 30 (if you used Benediction's effect at least twice earlier in the game) just like Shieldmaiden; and finally that card might actually see play lol.
My entire inspiration for the effect was the Control Priest vs Fatigue Warrior match up I keep running into where Warrior is the only class that can go above 30 health and it makes the match up impossible for priest outside of using Sideshow Spelleater and Justicar Trueheart. So, the precedent for this effect is already in the game.
- An effect better than Shadow Word: Death as a freebie - isn't that broken?
The effect of Anathema isn't a freebie, if you play this weapon on curve on turn 3 the earliest you can use the Anathema effect is Turn 8 outside of Garrison Commander shenanigans (which would result in horrible tempo and all your turns consumed by hero power). Then you have to wait another 5 turns to use it again, it's ten mana over the course of five turns to achieve the effect not including the equip cost.
This card is balanced by the fact that Benediction gives no real advantage outside getting the priest out of OTK range and increasing it's resilience to fatigue. Anathema's effect is balanced by the fact that it can't be used on demand, only on every 5th turn after this card is played (if you use 2 mana on hero power every turn, slowing your own tempo.. again this effect takes 10 mana to reach and use); and if you sit on Anathema you are missing out on hero power. Your opponent can also destroy your weapon causing the last minion you healed to be destroyed. The entire concept of this card is to strengthen Priest's fatigue tools.
In regards to an effect that goes on and on, we already have that in Shadowformand Justicar Trueheart's battlecry. Not to mention Shaman's Charged Hammer which gives a permanent effect. So I think that is a moot point... This is a defensively oriented card as opposed to Shaman's offensive. And of the three only Shadowform's effect can be countered (by a pre-emptive counterspell).
Also limiting weapons to a minimum of 1 attack is simply restricting and unnecessary in my opinion. And if you think weapons should simply be for getting card advantage trading with minions, then I understand; but the entire purpose of this is to consider Non-Traditional weapons.
I've been playing priest a lot lately; losing to fatigue warrior. And I was just imagining what tools the class could get to compete with fatigue; and this is what I came up with. I really like the idea of Non-Traditional Weapons for the'caster' classes; just looking for input and others ideas! Chose the Vanilla WoW class quest weapon for priest, it's a classic.
Benediction/Anathema Concept (Edit): http://imgur.com/a/dvo3I
Too complex and just way too much text overall. Try to keep it simple and direct.
It's not too complex, works a lot like gorehowl; but when it comes to card text I'd appreciate any help in figuring out how to shrink it down lol.
How about:
Benediction: Inspire: Your Hero gains +2 Health. Lose 1 Durability. Deathrattle: Equip a 0/1 Anathema.
Anathema: Inspire: Destroy the minion that you healed. Lose 1 Durability. Deathrattle: Equip a 0/4 Benediction.
It seems like a fascinating concept to have an infinite weapon, however if you're seriously going for the 3 mana it might be a bit too powerful. 3 mana to give a major boost to your hero power every once in a while a decent boost the rest of the time doesn't seem like that much of an investment for such a powerful effect. That's just my take on it, good idea!
Remember when everyone though The Caverns Below and Sherazin, Corpse Flower were trash?
Bet your salty tears wish that were true EleGiggle
Use the Inspire mechanic.
For Benediction
Inspire: Give your hero +2 armor and lose 1 durability. Deathrattle: Equip Anathema.
For Anathema
Inspire: Destroy the last minion that was healed and lose 1 durability.
Or
Inspire: Destroy a random enemy minion and lose 1 durability.
First card I ever created, and this makes it much better; thanks for the input. I'm also toying with Anathema being a 0/4 as well and just acting like shadow form. So it's a 3 mana card that acts like shadowform but lets you revert back to healing. And with your text @agithore on benediction it could have synergy with the shadowform card.
My reasoning for it being 3 mana is that it takes 4 turns of using a low value hero power to set up for the high value hero power. If it was 7 mana like gorehowl, it would be turn 12 before you could actually do anything with it. But I'm not expert on balance so I completely threw 3 mana out there. Because with 3 mana you can use the anathema effect on turn 8 at the earliest (excluding garrison commander shenanigans).
Don't get disheartened mate. ^^ Definitely an interesting idea, a bit rough around the edges however.
You definitely should use the Inspire keyword. And remember that the inspire text will activate together with your hero power, and not replace it. The suggestion:
"Benediction: Inspire: Your Hero gains +2 Health. Lose 1 Durability. Deathrattle: Equip a 0/1 Anathema."
If used in your hero, will have a boost of 4 health, which may be too much.
Pleas vote on my submission on the Weekly Card Design Competition: Fahrum Specter!
Increasing the max health of the hero is certainly stronger. It's also unique, but I would say 3 mana would still be fair. The weapon does nothing for tempo for a min of 4 turns. Yes it gives increased value to the HP but not permanently.
With 2 of these in a fatigue priest, along with justicar, you could achieve 46 max health and realistically escape all but the biggest burst decks.
Also considering making there be no deathrattle on anathema for balance, but it does limit the health gain to 46. Which I think is still solid for what this card is attempting to do.
How do the Deathrattles work if I equip another Weapon over them with something like Blingtron?
Make the Card: The biggest thread on the site!
My mandibles which are capable of pressing down and tearing, my talons which are known to intercept and hold.
My assumption given the mechanics, is that the deathrattle would overwrite the weapon given by blingtron. Bling's weapon destroys Benediction, then Anathema overwrites Bling's weapon.
Is it really that hard to click the 5th button on the right? If you don't include your cards in the post you make baby Sylvanas cry.
Also, Keep. It. Simple. Benediction: 3 mana 1/4. "Inspire: Restore 2 Health to your hero."
Anathema... Uh what? Does this turn the Priest hero power into a "Destroy an enemy minion"!? And if I wanted that, wouldn't I just put Shadow Word: Death in my deck instead?
Well, if you notice this is my first thread ever; so thanks for the tip!
And my idea is not to have the weapon be used to attack (following the lines of Warcraft where caster's use their weapons to channel magic, rather than use them in melee combat), so 0/4 over 1/4.
Also "Inspire: Restore 2 Health" isn't the cards intent, the intent is to give you the ability to heal over the maximum of 30 much like warrior's armor; the effect is akin to Power Word: Shield for your hero. And Anathema is simply a by product of Benediction, like Ashbringer is to Tirion Fordring.
Regarding Shadow Word: Death it is weaker than Anathema. Anathema's effect will kill any minion and not something that is just over 5 attack i.e. Ysera.
Te concept is a great idea. I think each class should have weapons and secrets for sure. They can benefit the class such as a 0-1 damage Mage weapon that increases spell power or similar for healing with priests, but every class uses weapons in WoW, so why not add them to HS?
the same for secrets. Each class should have a trick or two up their sleeves like for warrior they could have (for lack of a better word) under-armor or something like that.
Classes with a proficiency in weapons or secrets still have an advantage but it's something each should have available.
Quoth the raven...
I feel like there's a good idea there with "under-armor" lol. Warrior secrets that trigger when the opponent breaks through your armor. May give a warrior deck a reason to not try to get to 40 armor while still protecting your life total.
You have a point about Warcraft weapons. However, I think Hearthstone should stand on its own. We already have casters smacking stuff with weapons (Shaman, thoughtstealing priests, Blingtron...) so I feel that in the context of this game, weapons should always have at least 1 attack, even staffs.
I'm also not a fan of effects that go on and on and on until the opponent counters it. They exist in Hearthstone (Dreadsteed comes to mind) but there is a serious cost penalty to it. I understand that you wanted to mimic the effect of the item in World of Warcraft, but you chose one that's really tricky to make into a good Hearthstone card. There are just too many issues with it.
- Unlimited effect unless countered by Acidic Swamp Ooze or Harrison Jones
- No other card can increase a hero's health above 30 - is this really good for the game?
- An effect better than Shadow Word: Death as a freebie - isn't that broken?
It's an interesting idea but I'd go for something easier first get a feeling for good Hearthstone card design, then come back to these.
I have a good feeling for Hearthstone card design. The whole point of this post though is to think of Non-Traditional Class Weapons and have a discussion. And in regards to your presented issues they are easily answered.
There are plenty of cards that do that Armorsmith, Shieldmaiden, Bash, Shield Block, Ice Barrier, Claw, and Bite. Along with the Warrior Class's natural hero powers Armor Up! and Tank Up! same with Druid's Shapeshift and Dire Shapeshift it's already in the game in the form of Armor (healing with no limit); and this card simulates that effect. Just looking for a more class appropriate mechanic, though Armor could easily be used as a substitute. It's just that this effect let's priest use a card like Priestess of Elune to recoup health over 30 if at 30 (if you used Benediction's effect at least twice earlier in the game) just like Shieldmaiden; and finally that card might actually see play lol.
My entire inspiration for the effect was the Control Priest vs Fatigue Warrior match up I keep running into where Warrior is the only class that can go above 30 health and it makes the match up impossible for priest outside of using Sideshow Spelleater and Justicar Trueheart. So, the precedent for this effect is already in the game.
The effect of Anathema isn't a freebie, if you play this weapon on curve on turn 3 the earliest you can use the Anathema effect is Turn 8 outside of Garrison Commander shenanigans (which would result in horrible tempo and all your turns consumed by hero power). Then you have to wait another 5 turns to use it again, it's ten mana over the course of five turns to achieve the effect not including the equip cost.
This card is balanced by the fact that Benediction gives no real advantage outside getting the priest out of OTK range and increasing it's resilience to fatigue. Anathema's effect is balanced by the fact that it can't be used on demand, only on every 5th turn after this card is played (if you use 2 mana on hero power every turn, slowing your own tempo.. again this effect takes 10 mana to reach and use); and if you sit on Anathema you are missing out on hero power. Your opponent can also destroy your weapon causing the last minion you healed to be destroyed. The entire concept of this card is to strengthen Priest's fatigue tools.
In regards to an effect that goes on and on, we already have that in Shadowform and Justicar Trueheart's battlecry. Not to mention Shaman's Charged Hammer which gives a permanent effect. So I think that is a moot point... This is a defensively oriented card as opposed to Shaman's offensive. And of the three only Shadowform's effect can be countered (by a pre-emptive counterspell).
Also limiting weapons to a minimum of 1 attack is simply restricting and unnecessary in my opinion. And if you think weapons should simply be for getting card advantage trading with minions, then I understand; but the entire purpose of this is to consider Non-Traditional weapons.