Very happy with this one. From a selfish perspective, I don't play Shudderwock Shaman or any handbuff decks and I hate playing against them, so good news all-round for me here!
For a long time now, this card has been at or near the top of the most-played cards list on HSReplay (was #5 when I looked just now). Any time a card stays that popular for that length of time there has to be consideration of whether the power level is appropriate. When that card is also a core part of a combo that can lead to incredibly long and tedious matches or even literally game-breaking animations, I think it's fair to say you've got a problem card.
I also think this is a really elegant nerf. In a lot of decks this change literally does nothing to affect the power level of the card; it's very targeted to decks that look to abuse the card in ways that generally lead to un-fun games for the opponent.
There are a few fringe cases where this is a shame (Val'anyr Paladin or Hir'eek, the Bat Warlock for example), but I think it's worth it for the benefits elsewhere.
Current Shudderwock dies, but there's stil potential. By running Seaforium Bomber, the Fire Plume Harbinger + Murmuring Elemental set up and Zola, the Gorgon you could actually build a deck able to deal up to 45 damage over the course of the game. Add Lifedrinker and you can add a further 18 + healing. Finish up with Hagatha, the Witch and Primordial Drake to turn Shudderwock into a board nuke that healss you for 12, deals 12 damage to the opponent and shuffles 4-6 bombs into their deck (additionally to the 2-3 that were already in there).
Against control decks that's a lot of damage, while you still have the value from Hagatha. You can even run Baleful Banker and Elise, Trailblazer as an added value engine (and occasionally shuffle another Shudder if they leave it up).
Against aggro you still have all the great boardclears and healing.
Considering Shudderwock wasn't really anything more than a tier 3 deck on average I doubt this would work out all that well, but it's a possibility we shouldn't ignore, especially considering that with Shudder and Kingsbane gone and Druid nerfed the amount of decks that beat you via inevitability is decreased.
On a side note this is a minor nerf to Keleseth decks and Even Paladin, even though they probably won't feel it that much. At least the degenerate Soul Infusion combo is gone now.
This hurts Tempo rogue big time, which makes me sad since I enjoy the deck with lots of tech cards...that being said a turn 4 8/10 over 2 minions WITH taunt was busted, there's no doubt. Might still play a 1 of since it's still higher above the curve than most interchangable 4 drops.
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If you thought you knew what you think I know, then you'd know I knew you knew I know.
This is great. While the card itself was a good card, other cancerous cards like Prince and Shudderwock took advantage of this poor guy. What I'm glad to see is that blizzard can do other nerfs aside from +1 or +2 mana. Love it.
Shudderwock has always been strong in tournament play over ranked play, recent tournaments with the current expansion have shown this is still the case so I'm glad laddering isnt the only factor being addressed in changes.
It also helps vs Keleseth highrolls which is very relevant to ladder, but doesn't destroy the card entirely as it's still a great turn 4 play. Overall I see this as a great quality of life change even as a Shudderwock player
I'm guessing this is aimed at Shudderwock and Zoolock, but I wonder how consistent Blizzard is going to be with this. Summoning a copy (Doubling Imp anyone) isn't unique to Chain Gang. If they print another neutral 'Summon a copy of this minion' card in the next expansion it'll just be hilarious. Odd thing is, if they're doing this for Wild, what about Doppelgangster? Won't that still work?
yeah but doppel doesn't have taunt and wild is so tempo driven that a 1 mana difference is massive , hence why rogue decks are starting to use walk the plank instead of vilespine
I'm convinced that the nerf should have gone to Grumble or Shudderwock itself, but mainly Grumble. I never crafted him because of how broken I realised the combo was, and could never be fucked with waiting for my own turn to take +5mins. So I would use Shudderwock as I think was intended and not as a piece of shit. I'd get 3-4 shudders on the board , hopefully buffed and have to play around AoE and full board clears whilst using him as a finisher. Now he's just lame.
Happy with the nerfs, not this one though.
And yeah I know there's wild and dopplegangster, been playing the game for fucking ever.
lol wild shudder wont use dopplegagsters, not when Jade golems exist
I'm convinced that the nerf should have gone to Grumble or Shudderwock itself, but mainly Grumble. I never crafted him because of how broken I realised the combo was, and could never be fucked with waiting for my own turn to take +5mins. So I would use Shudderwock as I think was intended and not as a piece of shit. I'd get 3-4 shudders on the board , hopefully buffed and have to play around AoE and full board clears whilst using him as a finisher. Now he's just lame.
Happy with the nerfs, not this one though.
And yeah I know there's wild and dopplegangster, been playing the game for fucking ever.
lol wild shudder wont use dopplegagsters, not when Jade golems exist
I'm so sad. I mean I get why they nerfed it, and it's not that it's a bad nerf, it's just that this hits Handbuff which I can say from experience does not need nerfing. Especially since they specified Shudderwock as the problem it'd be nice if either Saronite Chain Gang kept buffs or they nerfed Grumble, Worldshaker instead.
I still have a faint hope it'll keep buffs since it uses the world "another" instead of "a," but I know that's unlikely.
I'm convinced that the nerf should have gone to Grumble or Shudderwock itself, but mainly Grumble. I never crafted him because of how broken I realised the combo was, and could never be fucked with waiting for my own turn to take +5mins. So I would use Shudderwock as I think was intended and not as a piece of shit. I'd get 3-4 shudders on the board , hopefully buffed and have to play around AoE and full board clears whilst using him as a finisher. Now he's just lame.
Happy with the nerfs, not this one though.
And yeah I know there's wild and dopplegangster, been playing the game for fucking ever.
Yup, I've been saying this from the start. Grumble would've been a better nerf imo.
I'm convinced that the nerf should have gone to Grumble or Shudderwock itself, but mainly Grumble. I never crafted him because of how broken I realised the combo was, and could never be fucked with waiting for my own turn to take +5mins. So I would use Shudderwock as I think was intended and not as a piece of shit. I'd get 3-4 shudders on the board , hopefully buffed and have to play around AoE and full board clears whilst using him as a finisher. Now he's just lame.
Happy with the nerfs, not this one though.
And yeah I know there's wild and dopplegangster, been playing the game for fucking ever.
Yup, I've been saying this from the start. Grumble would've been a better nerf imo.
I have a golden Grumble, (from a pack, didn't craft it) so for that reason alone I would love that haha.
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Very happy with this one. From a selfish perspective, I don't play Shudderwock Shaman or any handbuff decks and I hate playing against them, so good news all-round for me here!
For a long time now, this card has been at or near the top of the most-played cards list on HSReplay (was #5 when I looked just now). Any time a card stays that popular for that length of time there has to be consideration of whether the power level is appropriate. When that card is also a core part of a combo that can lead to incredibly long and tedious matches or even literally game-breaking animations, I think it's fair to say you've got a problem card.
I also think this is a really elegant nerf. In a lot of decks this change literally does nothing to affect the power level of the card; it's very targeted to decks that look to abuse the card in ways that generally lead to un-fun games for the opponent.
There are a few fringe cases where this is a shame (Val'anyr Paladin or Hir'eek, the Bat Warlock for example), but I think it's worth it for the benefits elsewhere.
Current Shudderwock dies, but there's stil potential. By running Seaforium Bomber, the Fire Plume Harbinger + Murmuring Elemental set up and Zola, the Gorgon you could actually build a deck able to deal up to 45 damage over the course of the game. Add Lifedrinker and you can add a further 18 + healing. Finish up with Hagatha, the Witch and Primordial Drake to turn Shudderwock into a board nuke that healss you for 12, deals 12 damage to the opponent and shuffles 4-6 bombs into their deck (additionally to the 2-3 that were already in there).
Against control decks that's a lot of damage, while you still have the value from Hagatha. You can even run Baleful Banker and Elise, Trailblazer as an added value engine (and occasionally shuffle another Shudder if they leave it up).
Against aggro you still have all the great boardclears and healing.
Considering Shudderwock wasn't really anything more than a tier 3 deck on average I doubt this would work out all that well, but it's a possibility we shouldn't ignore, especially considering that with Shudder and Kingsbane gone and Druid nerfed the amount of decks that beat you via inevitability is decreased.
On a side note this is a minor nerf to Keleseth decks and Even Paladin, even though they probably won't feel it that much. At least the degenerate Soul Infusion combo is gone now.
I tried having fun once. It was awful.
Its still good with Jades in wild. So for me i dont care. My jade-shudderwock is still good to go
it's a shudderwock nerf, and yet it nerfs all hand/deck buffs aswell..
This hurts Tempo rogue big time, which makes me sad since I enjoy the deck with lots of tech cards...that being said a turn 4 8/10 over 2 minions WITH taunt was busted, there's no doubt. Might still play a 1 of since it's still higher above the curve than most interchangable 4 drops.
If you thought you knew what you think I know, then you'd know I knew you knew I know.
This is great. While the card itself was a good card, other cancerous cards like Prince and Shudderwock took advantage of this poor guy. What I'm glad to see is that blizzard can do other nerfs aside from +1 or +2 mana. Love it.
Shudderwock has always been strong in tournament play over ranked play, recent tournaments with the current expansion have shown this is still the case so I'm glad laddering isnt the only factor being addressed in changes.
It also helps vs Keleseth highrolls which is very relevant to ladder, but doesn't destroy the card entirely as it's still a great turn 4 play. Overall I see this as a great quality of life change even as a Shudderwock player
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yeah but doppel doesn't have taunt and wild is so tempo driven that a 1 mana difference is massive , hence why rogue decks are starting to use walk the plank instead of vilespine
the card should have been worded like this anyways. this is how it should have been from the beginning. would have avoided SO much shudderwock crap
lol wild shudder wont use dopplegagsters, not when Jade golems exist
Evolve
I'm so sad. I mean I get why they nerfed it, and it's not that it's a bad nerf, it's just that this hits Handbuff which I can say from experience does not need nerfing. Especially since they specified Shudderwock as the problem it'd be nice if either Saronite Chain Gang kept buffs or they nerfed Grumble, Worldshaker instead.
I still have a faint hope it'll keep buffs since it uses the world "another" instead of "a," but I know that's unlikely.
Edit: Hope gone, no buffs. This sucks. :(
They have actually nerfed Surrender to Madness priest with this
not a good news for Zoolock and Shudder Shammie.
"hey! hey! you wanna buy a funnel cake?"
This was suggested way back when Witchwood released and Shudderwock was immediately an issue.
Way to keep up Blizzard
Oh noes, my Val'anyr! Give me dust, blizz!
Yup, I've been saying this from the start. Grumble would've been a better nerf imo.
And look at that, the card is still good. :)
People focus on shudderwock, but I'm more happy for the keleseth interaction.
Best nerf I have seen yet. The card is still playable in most decks except Shudderwock.
If you are in your first year of playing please read this post.
Dust does not burn a hole in the jar. Be careful what you craft, especially before and right after a rotation.
I have a golden Grumble, (from a pack, didn't craft it) so for that reason alone I would love that haha.