There are two main constructed Standard competitive modes : Tournament and Ladder.
Yet the meta between those are widely different due to Voidlord. This card summoned on turn 6 by controlish warlocks basically reads "game over for aggro deck unless you can silence it". However, in tournament, all pleayers have a cheap meta option to counter voidlord : just ban the warlock class:
This needs to be adressed, as tournament and ladder shoudl be similar game modes, either by nerfing voidlord OR by changing tournament format to "ban 3 classes, opponent can keep one of those 3".
I think the current distorsion is creating a distorted metagame wher eStandard and tournament mode feature very different game rankings
Voidlord isn't a problematic card by itself, it's just the very cheesy ways warlock has of cheating out demons with lackey, bloodreaver and skull. A 5 mana 2/2 that draws and PLAYS a 9 drop is ridiculous no matter what 9 drop in the game it'd pull, Voidlord is a totally fine and balanced card when you actually have to pay 9 mana for it. Doomguard for free spam is equally as oppressive in my eyes, but again it's not doomguard's fault, it's the cheesy ways of getting it into play for free without its drawback being a thing.
this.
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-let´s negotiate: you concede and I let you live...
We have to wait and see this week's Vicious Syndicate report, but the trend from the past 2 weeks has been that Control Warlock is a Tier 2-3 deck and declining because everyone is now teching against it. You should focus on the power of Bonemare and Cobalt Scalebane, some of the tools that have made Tempo Rogue a powerhouse for the past 3 months.
We have to wait and see this week's Vicious Syndicate report, but the trend from the past 2 weeks has been that Control Warlock is a Tier 2-3 deck and declining because everyone is now teching against it. You should focus on the power of Bonemare and Cobalt Scalebane, some of the tools that have made Tempo Rogue a powerhouse for the past 3 months.
I totally second that. Just have started playing Cubelock at rank 16 on EU (didn't have time to play the deck this season) and I have to say that nearly every deck I was facing had techs ready for my deck. The deck is still strong but it's not easy anymore to get a 60+% win rate.
Voidlord is not a problem at all, unless you play aggro/face decks, which should have counters. Voidlord is literally only good in aggro matchups - in control matchups it is easily removed - 3 attack is not a lot in those matches.
you forgot, that there isn't just one VL in the deck and it can be summoned by N'Zoth and Bloodreaver Guldan. In worst case you have to get rid of 6 VL in one match. Have fun doin it, while the warlock is goin face with his doomguards ;-).
But the main problem is the lackey that cheat the VL in the early game.
There are a lot of things in this game that are ,,game over,, when your opponent plays them, and you CANT even silence/ do anything about a lot of those ( turn 5 Raza --> turn 8 Anduin , turn 2 Keleseth into Shadowstep come to mind ) . Also...news flash: EVERY tier 1 deck pretty much has to have some unbeatable hands, tier 1 decks are generally not always ,,fair,, . If you ask me Cubelock is the most fair tier 1 deck in a long time ( You can silence their cubes/voidlords , remove their weapon , is vulnerable to OTKs...) . Excuse me aggro players but not every deck has to be vulnerable to brainless smorc for it to be balanced.
However, in tournament, all pleayers have a cheap meta option to counter voidlord : just ban the warlock class
"In response to numerous whinging in forums, the Warlock class will be rotating out of Standard next week! Enjoy the HCT Championship!" - Ben Brode at HCT next week
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"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
Well if he is summoning VL and Voidwalkers instead of Doom Guards he can't really hit face that hard with the lacking Doom Guards that didn't get resummoned.
Voidlord is a 9 mana card 3/9 taunt demon with 3 1/3 taunts in the deathrattle not exactly a broken card.
Cheating out 9 mana cards and other power cards which have can have their drawbacks circumvented is a problem if that cheating out doesn’t have enough drawbacks if it’s own.
Possesed Lackey and the Skull definitely falls into this category. And to a lesser extent Gul’dan and N’zoth (these are 10 mana for a reason).
Sometimes they pull the doomguard when you need a taunt, the cheat out is necessary to combat aggro decks that have you dead by turn 7. Yes fair, due to the fact that aggro decks if drawing favourable has dead by turn 5. So if you are able to survive long enough to cheat a VL. early you deserve a reward. Ie. A chance at a win. Due to a silence just ables you to finish the job. Hence tech card.
It's interesting to me that Silver Vanguard only cheats 1 mana, but Possessed Lackey cheats upward of 5 (if a 10 mana demon is released). I don't think that Silver Vanguard being a neutral and having +1/+1 stats makes the difference.
The balanced value probably lies somewhere between the two.
The more I think about it, the more confident I am that Possessed Lackey is probably going to be nerfed.
Control/Cube Warlock is a great thing to have in the meta imo. No matter what deck I play against them, the games are always fun, complicated and pretty even.
Voidlord comes out on turn 5 or 6 with the right combo, and aggro kills someone on turn 4-6 depending on draws. it has felt pretty fair in matches for me on both sides with pally or warlock depending on the draws.
There are two main constructed Standard competitive modes : Tournament and Ladder.
Yet the meta between those are widely different due to Voidlord. This card summoned on turn 6 by controlish warlocks basically reads "game over for aggro deck unless you can silence it". However, in tournament, all pleayers have a cheap meta option to counter voidlord : just ban the warlock class:
https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveHS/comments/7pb7qz/world_championship_decklistslineups/
This needs to be adressed, as tournament and ladder shoudl be similar game modes, either by nerfing voidlord OR by changing tournament format to "ban 3 classes, opponent can keep one of those 3".
I think the current distorsion is creating a distorted metagame wher eStandard and tournament mode feature very different game rankings
If only I could delete Patches so I could create something instead of slamming the same shit in every class and calling it “Aggro”
-let´s negotiate: you concede and I let you live...
We have to wait and see this week's Vicious Syndicate report, but the trend from the past 2 weeks has been that Control Warlock is a Tier 2-3 deck and declining because everyone is now teching against it. You should focus on the power of Bonemare and Cobalt Scalebane, some of the tools that have made Tempo Rogue a powerhouse for the past 3 months.
Nice
You are describing the difference between ladder and tournament. Voidlord is not the issue here. Ladder is.
Hey. =)
How does one access tournament mode in-game? I play every day and somehow I missed it. I guess 'everyone is legend' hogwash wasn't enough.
Free to try and find a game, dealing cards for sorrow, cards for pain.
Voidlord is not a problem at all, unless you play aggro/face decks, which should have counters. Voidlord is literally only good in aggro matchups - in control matchups it is easily removed - 3 attack is not a lot in those matches.
It is written nowhere that ladder and tournament should have similar meta.
Voidlord is also not a problem.
Card/Value cheating is (independently of tournament).
you forgot, that there isn't just one VL in the deck and it can be summoned by N'Zoth and Bloodreaver Guldan. In worst case you have to get rid of 6 VL in one match. Have fun doin it, while the warlock is goin face with his doomguards ;-).
But the main problem is the lackey that cheat the VL in the early game.
There are a lot of things in this game that are ,,game over,, when your opponent plays them, and you CANT even silence/ do anything about a lot of those ( turn 5 Raza --> turn 8 Anduin , turn 2 Keleseth into Shadowstep come to mind ) . Also...news flash: EVERY tier 1 deck pretty much has to have some unbeatable hands, tier 1 decks are generally not always ,,fair,, . If you ask me Cubelock is the most fair tier 1 deck in a long time ( You can silence their cubes/voidlords , remove their weapon , is vulnerable to OTKs...) . Excuse me aggro players but not every deck has to be vulnerable to brainless smorc for it to be balanced.
"Speculation is foolish when the tools of certainty are available." —Cinna, Vedalken Consul
One day this game will stop existing. I can't wait.
Well if he is summoning VL and Voidwalkers instead of Doom Guards he can't really hit face that hard with the lacking Doom Guards that didn't get resummoned.
Classic misunderstanding the problem card.
Voidlord is a 9 mana card 3/9 taunt demon with 3 1/3 taunts in the deathrattle not exactly a broken card.
Cheating out 9 mana cards and other power cards which have can have their drawbacks circumvented is a problem if that cheating out doesn’t have enough drawbacks if it’s own.
Possesed Lackey and the Skull definitely falls into this category. And to a lesser extent Gul’dan and N’zoth (these are 10 mana for a reason).
Long story short: All decks try to cheat in some way, Voidlord on turn 6 is just Control Warlock's way of cheating.
Sometimes they pull the doomguard when you need a taunt, the cheat out is necessary to combat aggro decks that have you dead by turn 7. Yes fair, due to the fact that aggro decks if drawing favourable has dead by turn 5. So if you are able to survive long enough to cheat a VL. early you deserve a reward. Ie. A chance at a win. Due to a silence just ables you to finish the job. Hence tech card.
It's interesting to me that Silver Vanguard only cheats 1 mana, but Possessed Lackey cheats upward of 5 (if a 10 mana demon is released). I don't think that Silver Vanguard being a neutral and having +1/+1 stats makes the difference.
The balanced value probably lies somewhere between the two.
The more I think about it, the more confident I am that Possessed Lackey is probably going to be nerfed.
Control/Cube Warlock is a great thing to have in the meta imo. No matter what deck I play against them, the games are always fun, complicated and pretty even.
Highlander Priest on the other hand.....
Voidlord comes out on turn 5 or 6 with the right combo, and aggro kills someone on turn 4-6 depending on draws. it has felt pretty fair in matches for me on both sides with pally or warlock depending on the draws.