Extremely slow effect that while seems good won't do much unless the aggro decks become non existent. 6 mana 4/4 that you have to freeze other minions to get a copy in your HAND.
Just look at the mistcaller. 6 mana 4/4 with a more immediate effect and still unimpressivly slow
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Would like for you to explain in more detail where you got the number 10 for freeze effects in shaman, just curious because I could only find 7 including Servant of Kalimos
I think most people are thinking more along the lines of class cards that freeze minions more so than neutral minions. Frost Elemental, Frozen Crusher, will be used by no one. You can generate Glacial Shard from Servant of Kalimos which wouldn't be bad as Glacial Shard seems to be one of the best cards for Moorabi. Frost Shock while not good could maybe be used because it is such a cheap spell for shaman's to generate a minion. Of course we also have the 2 new cards in Knight of the Frozen Throne Cryostasis and Voodoo Hexxer. Voodoo Hexxer seems to be a pretty solid card while Cryostasis seems to be pretty good too.
This right now gives us really only 5 cards which would be considered to be played in a deck with Moorabi and one of these isn't even guaranteed to give us a freeze effect.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Check out my Youtube Channel for Hearthstone Videos be sure to Subscribe :)
This guy seems good on paper but I feel that in practice, he'll fall flat.
A 6 mana 4/4 draw a card would actually be pretty bad. Remember good ol' Azure Drake? Yeah, that guy was amazing! And he didn't need to be combo'd! Moorabi here is a 6 mana 4/4 that requires more cards to activate. To the best of my knowledge, Frost Shock and Glacial Shard are the cheapest means of freezing a minion available to shaman. That means that to get immediate value, you'll have to have 7 mana minimum, which essentially turns this into a two card 7 mana 4/4 draw a card combo. Looking at it that way, this guy is bad.
But, hold your horses. Unlike Azure Drake, you can continue to snowball value out of Moorabi here. The moment you draw a second card by freezing a second minion, this guy doesn't seem too horrible. It's not great yet, but two cards are pretty nice and there's the added bonus of having two things frozen on the board. Not too shabby. The moment he draws that third card though, that's when he finally goes from being bad to pretty solid (pun intended. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH....yeah).
In short, and just being blunt here, I don't think he'll see much play. He's too niche and requires too much setup to get the required value out of him. When he works, he'll work great! But more often than not I don't see him working very well at all. Though if enough synergy cards are revealed and a shaman freeze deck becomes viable, this guy always makes the cut! And, if that happens, I'll eat my words because this guy will be a card generating powerhouse that requires an answer.
This is a Gadgetzan Auctioneer tailor-made for the Shaman class, which has access to versatile freezing so far. You also control exactly what you draw while freezing enemy minions/ the hero. By extension, he's less vulnerable because a lot of things on board will likely be frozen by that point. Besides that, he shares the same set of weaknesses as Gadgetzan Auctioneer, which is one of the most busted cards in the game despite its low stats.
Moorabi still needs a bit more support, but that's almost certainly on the way.
Eh, I don't like the comparison to Gadgetzan Auctioneer. There's a huge difference between card cycle and card generation.
Then let me ask you this: which one does Shaman want more? Cycle, or generation? Let me put this comparison another way:
Auctioneer (in Rogue) lets you use your cheap spells in your hand and deck (Eviscerate, Fan of Knives, etc.) without losing card advantage, even sometimes generating card advantage, allow you to use various spells that build in impact over the course of a turn. In the process, you generate amazing tempo where you wouldn't otherwise while drawing towards the cards you want.
Moorabi converts your freeze cards (Glacial Shard, Frost Shock, whatever else we see), low-impact tools that stall the game but lose value over time (similar to Rogue spells), into high-value minions, which is exactly what a slow Control Shaman wants.
Another example: Lyra the Sunshard converts your Priest spells, which normally sit in your hand waiting to be used at the right time, into more Priest spells, generating value while making board impact.
What do they have in common? They convert reactive cards into proactive cards. Auctioneer is good for Rogues (and Jade Druid), Lyra is good for Priests, and Moorabi, in turn, will be good for Shamans.
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Would like for you to explain in more detail where you got the number 10 for freeze effects in shaman, just curious because I could only find 7 including Servant of Kalimos
I think most people are thinking more along the lines of class cards that freeze minions more so than neutral minions. Frost Elemental, Frozen Crusher, will be used by no one. You can generate Glacial Shard from Servant of Kalimos which wouldn't be bad as Glacial Shard seems to be one of the best cards for Moorabi. Frost Shock while not good could maybe be used because it is such a cheap spell for shaman's to generate a minion. Of course we also have the 2 new cards in Knight of the Frozen Throne Cryostasis and Voodoo Hexxer. Voodoo Hexxer seems to be a pretty solid card while Cryostasis seems to be pretty good too.
This right now gives us really only 5 cards which would be considered to be played in a deck with Moorabi and one of these isn't even guaranteed to give us a freeze effect.
We have:
2 - Ice Shards (name?) 1 Mana 2/1 freeze a minion
2 - Frost Elemental 6 Mana 5/5 freeze a minion
2 Frost Shock (is this Wild? I don't think it is)
2 New Taunt minion freeze enemy
2 New Epic give stats and freeze
Those are 10! And Kalimos can generate more as well as echo, so I believe there is already enough and surely we will have something else.
So is the same but you are counting "cards" as singles while I think about how many are in a possible deck.
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Would like for you to explain in more detail where you got the number 10 for freeze effects in shaman, just curious because I could only find 7 including Servant of Kalimos
I think most people are thinking more along the lines of class cards that freeze minions more so than neutral minions. Frost Elemental, Frozen Crusher, will be used by no one. You can generate Glacial Shard from Servant of Kalimos which wouldn't be bad as Glacial Shard seems to be one of the best cards for Moorabi. Frost Shock while not good could maybe be used because it is such a cheap spell for shaman's to generate a minion. Of course we also have the 2 new cards in Knight of the Frozen Throne Cryostasis and Voodoo Hexxer. Voodoo Hexxer seems to be a pretty solid card while Cryostasis seems to be pretty good too.
This right now gives us really only 5 cards which would be considered to be played in a deck with Moorabi and one of these isn't even guaranteed to give us a freeze effect.
2 copies of Shard, Cryostasis, Hexxer, Shock, and maybe Frost Elemental coupled with the Elemental or Control package and Moorabi himself.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"The quickest way to 'think outside the box' is to realize the truth: the only real box is the one you create by limiting your thoughts."
I'm going to guess the the shaman Hero card will have something to do with freezing and that might make it a good card if the hero power freezes an enemy minion.
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Would like for you to explain in more detail where you got the number 10 for freeze effects in shaman, just curious because I could only find 7 including Servant of Kalimos
I think most people are thinking more along the lines of class cards that freeze minions more so than neutral minions. Frost Elemental, Frozen Crusher, will be used by no one. You can generate Glacial Shard from Servant of Kalimos which wouldn't be bad as Glacial Shard seems to be one of the best cards for Moorabi. Frost Shock while not good could maybe be used because it is such a cheap spell for shaman's to generate a minion. Of course we also have the 2 new cards in Knight of the Frozen Throne Cryostasis and Voodoo Hexxer. Voodoo Hexxer seems to be a pretty solid card while Cryostasis seems to be pretty good too.
This right now gives us really only 5 cards which would be considered to be played in a deck with Moorabi and one of these isn't even guaranteed to give us a freeze effect.
2 copies of Shard, Cryostasis, Hexxer, Shock, and maybe Frost Elemental coupled with the Elemental or Control package and Moorabi himself.
See I was thinking he meant 10 UNIQUE cards lol so that does make more sense that he is say there are 10 cards playable in total.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Check out my Youtube Channel for Hearthstone Videos be sure to Subscribe :)
This guy seems good on paper but I feel that in practice, he'll fall flat.
A 6 mana 4/4 draw a card would actually be pretty bad. Remember good ol' Azure Drake? Yeah, that guy was amazing! And he didn't need to be combo'd! Moorabi here is a 6 mana 4/4 that requires more cards to activate. To the best of my knowledge, Frost Shock and Glacial Shard are the cheapest means of freezing a minion available to shaman. That means that to get immediate value, you'll have to have 7 mana minimum, which essentially turns this into a two card 7 mana 4/4 draw a card combo. Looking at it that way, this guy is bad.
But, hold your horses. Unlike Azure Drake, you can continue to snowball value out of Moorabi here. The moment you draw a second card by freezing a second minion, this guy doesn't seem too horrible. It's not great yet, but two cards are pretty nice and there's the added bonus of having two things frozen on the board. Not too shabby. The moment he draws that third card though, that's when he finally goes from being bad to pretty solid (pun intended. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH....yeah).
In short, and just being blunt here, I don't think he'll see much play. He's too niche and requires too much setup to get the required value out of him. When he works, he'll work great! But more often than not I don't see him working very well at all. Though if enough synergy cards are revealed and a shaman freeze deck becomes viable, this guy always makes the cut! And, if that happens, I'll eat my words because this guy will be a card generating powerhouse that requires an answer.
This is a Gadgetzan Auctioneer tailor-made for the Shaman class, which has access to versatile freezing so far. You also control exactly what you draw while freezing enemy minions/ the hero. By extension, he's less vulnerable because a lot of things on board will likely be frozen by that point. Besides that, he shares the same set of weaknesses as Gadgetzan Auctioneer, which is one of the most busted cards in the game despite its low stats.
Moorabi still needs a bit more support, but that's almost certainly on the way.
Eh, I don't like the comparison to Gadgetzan Auctioneer. There's a huge difference between card cycle and card generation.
Then let me ask you this: which one does Shaman want more? Cycle, or generation? Let me put this comparison another way:
Auctioneer (in Rogue) lets you use your cheap spells in your hand and deck (Eviscerate, Fan of Knives, etc.) without losing card advantage, even sometimes generating card advantage, allow you to use various spells that build in impact over the course of a turn. In the process, you generate amazing tempo where you wouldn't otherwise while drawing towards the cards you want.
Moorabi converts your freeze cards (Glacial Shard, Frost Shock, whatever else we see), low-impact tools that stall the game but lose value over time (similar to Rogue spells), into high-value minions, which is exactly what a slow Control Shaman wants.
Another example: Lyra the Sunshard converts your Priest spells, which normally sit in your hand waiting to be used at the right time, into more Priest spells, generating value while making board impact.
What do they have in common? They convert reactive cards into proactive cards. Auctioneer is good for Rogues (and Jade Druid), Lyra is good for Priests, and Moorabi, in turn, will be good for Shamans.
Well, I'm not going to go so far as to say that you're wrong because I can't predict the future. However, I have to again disagree with your comparisons to miracle's Gadgetzan Auctioneer and priest's Lyra the Sunshard.
Both of these classes have the tools to allow these to snowball out of control to ridiculous proportions. A miracle rogue with an auctioneer out has super cheap or 0 cost spells that can and often do cycle into other super cheap or 0 cost spells. It's not uncommon for a rogue to play 6+ spells in a turn for very little or no mana. A Lyra priest has Radiant Elementals to make their cheap spells to be even cheaper or (quite often) 0 cost and allows them to generate into more cheap or 0 cost spells and again, it's not uncommon for a priest to chain 5+ spells together for amazing value on the cheap.
Shaman and Moorabi here function fundamentally differently. When you freeze a minion with Moorabi on the board, unless the minion you are freezing can also freeze minions, the value train pretty much stops right there. It's not like an auctioneer or Lyra where one spell will lead into another.
Now, we're still a good 100 cards shy of knowing what's in store with the rest of the expansion and it's quite possible (maybe even likely) that shamans will in fact receive the tools necessary to allow their legendary to chain similar to Lyra. As it stands now though, with the information we have as of me writing this, it's an extremely poor comparison.
This guy seems good on paper but I feel that in practice, he'll fall flat.
A 6 mana 4/4 draw a card would actually be pretty bad. Remember good ol' Azure Drake? Yeah, that guy was amazing! And he didn't need to be combo'd! Moorabi here is a 6 mana 4/4 that requires more cards to activate. To the best of my knowledge, Frost Shock and Glacial Shard are the cheapest means of freezing a minion available to shaman. That means that to get immediate value, you'll have to have 7 mana minimum, which essentially turns this into a two card 7 mana 4/4 draw a card combo. Looking at it that way, this guy is bad.
But, hold your horses. Unlike Azure Drake, you can continue to snowball value out of Moorabi here. The moment you draw a second card by freezing a second minion, this guy doesn't seem too horrible. It's not great yet, but two cards are pretty nice and there's the added bonus of having two things frozen on the board. Not too shabby. The moment he draws that third card though, that's when he finally goes from being bad to pretty solid (pun intended. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH....yeah).
In short, and just being blunt here, I don't think he'll see much play. He's too niche and requires too much setup to get the required value out of him. When he works, he'll work great! But more often than not I don't see him working very well at all. Though if enough synergy cards are revealed and a shaman freeze deck becomes viable, this guy always makes the cut! And, if that happens, I'll eat my words because this guy will be a card generating powerhouse that requires an answer.
This is a Gadgetzan Auctioneer tailor-made for the Shaman class, which has access to versatile freezing so far. You also control exactly what you draw while freezing enemy minions/ the hero. By extension, he's less vulnerable because a lot of things on board will likely be frozen by that point. Besides that, he shares the same set of weaknesses as Gadgetzan Auctioneer, which is one of the most busted cards in the game despite its low stats.
Moorabi still needs a bit more support, but that's almost certainly on the way.
Eh, I don't like the comparison to Gadgetzan Auctioneer. There's a huge difference between card cycle and card generation.
Then let me ask you this: which one does Shaman want more? Cycle, or generation? Let me put this comparison another way:
Auctioneer (in Rogue) lets you use your cheap spells in your hand and deck (Eviscerate, Fan of Knives, etc.) without losing card advantage, even sometimes generating card advantage, allow you to use various spells that build in impact over the course of a turn. In the process, you generate amazing tempo where you wouldn't otherwise while drawing towards the cards you want.
Moorabi converts your freeze cards (Glacial Shard, Frost Shock, whatever else we see), low-impact tools that stall the game but lose value over time (similar to Rogue spells), into high-value minions, which is exactly what a slow Control Shaman wants.
Another example: Lyra the Sunshard converts your Priest spells, which normally sit in your hand waiting to be used at the right time, into more Priest spells, generating value while making board impact.
What do they have in common? They convert reactive cards into proactive cards. Auctioneer is good for Rogues (and Jade Druid), Lyra is good for Priests, and Moorabi, in turn, will be good for Shamans.
Well, I'm not going to go so far as to say that you're wrong because I can't predict the future. However, I have to again disagree with your comparisons to miracle's Gadgetzan Auctioneer and priest's Lyra the Sunshard.
Both of these classes have the tools to allow these to snowball out of control to ridiculous proportions. A miracle rogue with an auctioneer out has super cheap or 0 cost spells that can and often do cycle into other super cheap or 0 cost spells. It's not uncommon for a rogue to play 6+ spells in a turn for very little or no mana. A Lyra priest has Radiant Elementals to make their cheap spells to be even cheaper or (quite often) 0 cost and allows them to generate into more cheap or 0 cost spells and again, it's not uncommon for a priest to chain 5+ spells together for amazing value on the cheap.
Shaman and Moorabi here function fundamentally differently. When you freeze a minion with Moorabi on the board, unless the minion you are freezing can also freeze minions, the value train pretty much stops right there. It's not like an auctioneer or Lyra where one spell will lead into another.
Now, we're still a good 100 cards shy of knowing what's in store with the rest of the expansion and it's quite possible (maybe even likely) that shamans will in fact receive the tools necessary to allow their legendary to chain similar to Lyra. As it stands now though, with the information we have as of me writing this, it's an extremely poor comparison.
I think we're looking at this with different perspectives. I do agree there are fundamental differences in how each of them operate. However, they accomplish similar goals relevant to the class; it just looks different getting there and uses different tools. The value for Moorabi isn't creating a massive 5+ value spell chain within a single turn, and I don't think it needs to do that anyway. What you're trying to accomplish with Moorabi is create value over multiple turns, which happens to synergize perfectly with the Freeze mechanic. At the end of the day, you're still converting resources in your hand (Freeze cards) into other resources (desirable minions). In this particular case, it both shifts you into your late-game and freezes enemies at the same time.
Is it slow? Of course. But that's exactly what Freeze wants to do.
Moorabi converts your freeze cards (Glacial Shard, Frost Shock, whatever else we see), low-impact tools that stall the game but lose value over time (similar to Rogue spells), into high-value minions, which is exactly what a slow Control Shaman wants.
Another example: Lyra the Sunshard converts your Priest spells, which normally sit in your hand waiting to be used at the right time, into more Priest spells, generating value while making board impact.
What do they have in common? They convert reactive cards into proactive cards. Auctioneer is good for Rogues (and Jade Druid), Lyra is good for Priests, and Moorabi, in turn, will be good for Shamans.
This is what appeals to me, really. When I'm building a deck, the first question I try to answer is, "how do I stabilize against aggro?". Shaman obviously has a lot of AOE damage as it is, but freeze effects give you the ability to stall until your opponent overextends, or another shot at that spellpower totem roll if you need it. You can even freeze face if you fear a big Heroic Strike turn against Pirate Warrior. The next question is, "how do I play the value game with all of these low cost anti-aggro tools in my deck?". Like you said, Moorabi allows you to convert your Frost Shocks and Glacial Shards into high value minions while also stalling your opponent.
As for the tempo loss, I think it's generally OK at that point in the game. Any turn you play Moorabi, you're typically going to be freezing any big threats, which means your opponent has to use resources on removal if he wants to deal with it rather than building a bigger board. Maybe you lose the board; well, that's what Volcano is for.
I don't think Moorabi will be amazing, but it will generate a new archetype, even if it is not a tier 1 deck, and that is always excting for players (like me) that like one class over the others.
Extremely slow effect that while seems good won't do much unless the aggro decks become non existent. 6 mana 4/4 that you have to freeze other minions to get a copy in your HAND.
Just look at the mistcaller. 6 mana 4/4 with a more immediate effect and still unimpressivly slow
Need to see the rest of the set to evaluate this. Currently not enough freeze.
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Wonder why people say there isn't enough freeze, of the top of my head right now Shaman have acces to 10 freeze effects, not to mention elemental generation and Echo, if 10 freeze cards aren't enough support what would be?
I really want this one, seems like an alternative Lyra for value shaman, will at least be fun and Shaman Hero Card is very likely to ve freeze involved.
Check out my Youtube Channel for Hearthstone Videos be sure to Subscribe :)
Brads Gaming Youtube Channel
Too slow and clunky
"The quickest way to 'think outside the box' is to realize the truth: the only real box is the one you create by limiting your thoughts."
Bruce Garrabrandt
I'm going to guess the the shaman Hero card will have something to do with freezing and that might make it a good card if the hero power freezes an enemy minion.
Check out my Youtube Channel for Hearthstone Videos be sure to Subscribe :)
Brads Gaming Youtube Channel
Extremely clunky, but the potential is there.
Even with this card I can't help but feel that Frozen Shaman won't work.
Let it go...
Looks like they're really pushing the freeze mechanic....maybe a bit too much?
"Everything will be alright in the end, and if everything isn't alright then it isn't the end"
That doesn't work
Oh great, another six mana four four, because that worked previously
Should have read "becomes frozen" or even "gets frozen".
...
"I played this, and my minion IS frozen. Why doesn't it trigger..? It sais whenever a minion IS frozen, and my minion IS FROZEN! WTF BLIZZARD?!"