It's the Jade Elemental Shaman, which started to see play after the nerf of QR. Now, the reason for me making this thread is to make a little reminder, that this deck-type is still strong and, I believe, a specific version of it can deservedly take an honorable place among the competitive decks. While shaman doesn't have the fancy hard removals, which other classes have (Twisting Nether, Brawl, Dragonfire Potion and the priest DK), the biggest advantage of this deck-type is the ability to adapt to the presented meta. If this means tons of aggro, then we can tech in cheap AoEs and taunts. Burn? - bunch of healing. Control decks? - late game value.
About my deck - In the first 2 months of Un'goro I reached rank 4, last month I even went to rank 2. However, because the state of the meta constantly changes and the new one hasn't settled yet, I'm planning on doing some "improvements" and I want to see how the deck will do after I make them. I want to remake it in the context of the new expansion. But I would like to hear out your opinion, what exactly to change, which cards I shouldn't ignore etc.
It's true, that the Fire elementals are a nice inclusion and they activate the other big elementals (Kalimos, Servant, even Blazecaller when I ran a copy), I'm just trying out StrifeCro's jade elemental version (In that deck the streamer used 2x Fire Fly, Thing from below and Flametongue). The totems actually replace the elementals and I kinda like them, because they make any junk minion (small jades, totems) into better ones. Such, which can trade better. This goes for bigger minions as well.
The deck has been changed and the deck description has been updated. Only 1 card from the KoFT has been included, but I'm just trying to be very cautious on my card choices and to pick the most fitting ones.
That said, I feel I could make another change to the removal part. Don't know, if Doomsayer is needed or should I have a second copy of Lightning Storm, but that's why you are more than welcome to give me your feedback and to make changes of your own. :)
The deck has been changed and the deck description has been updated. Only 1 card from the KoFT has been included, but I'm just trying to be very cautious on my card choices and to pick the most fitting ones.
That said, I feel I could make another change to the removal part. Don't know, if Doomsayer is needed or should I have a second copy of Lightning Storm, but that's why you are more than welcome to give me your feedback and to make changes of your own. :)
My cents: I would try -2 hex (you have 2 devolve) +1 maelstrom +1 lightning storm or +1 lightning storm +1 volcano, as you wish...
My cents: I would try -2 hex (you have 2 devolve) +1 maelstrom +1 lightning storm or +1 lightning storm +1 volcano, as you wish...
First of all, thanks for the reply.
Normally people tell me to cut the devolves and to include more Hexes. I think, that you are right, I may have too many transform removals and I'm also feeling it. However, I kinda want to keep a copy of Hex, so I will cut only 1 copy of it for something else.
Regarding the replacement, I will take your suggestions into consideration and tomorrow I will make a test with each one of them.
[edit] i have been also thinking of putting back fire fly, because they work well with the flametongues but everytime when i make a change, i think "OK, do I want to top-deck this card in the late game" don't know of this is a right way to think, but if i follow this pattern, then the answer regarding my case will be volcano
So yeah, druids everywhere. That's why I thought I could cut some removals and make the deck even more minion based, in order to keep the pressure going.
Commentary on some of the cards:
Inb4 Skulking Geist makes the Jade Dudu MUs winable. This doesn't necessarily mean, that I will win every single game against them (still a slightly bad MU), but because the jades cap, this deck can handle theirs before 9 and 10.
Kalimos, Primal Lord - kinda feel guilty to say it, but he doesn't offer that much value right now. Yes, against aggro and mid-range decks he can have a huge impact (to save us from lethal damage or to destroy a whole board), but if you are mainly facing dudu, then you would know, that 8 mana deal 3 damage can't kill those beefy jades. And also 8 mana + this deck doesn't have that many elementals to activate him. Replacement - Maybe another Jade Chieftain? If we had a better card draw, then I would also consider running Blazecaller, because many times 5 damage is equal to "destroy a minion". I understand, the deck becomes more and more jade rather than elemental hybrid, but if we are going to win against jade dudu, then we have to play at their game.
Why not Stonehill Defender? Meh, I also face other decks and Tar creeper is just a good taunt. Only against control decks (dudu, priest, pala) I have the time to discover something from stonehill. But against aggro and mid-range, I would need better chances to survive. [That's why I run 2x devolve, but, like I said, I'm reconsidering this decision]
Like I said, Leute, this deck has the ability to adapt. And now I'm just trying to find the most optimal build.
I've been spamming for a while, but I'm almost done:
Let's start. It's not the most reliable deck against jade dudu, since they are better at drawing cards and summon their jades faster. I can honestly say, that this does really well against everything else, except burn, because I removed the heal for more pressure, and exodia. If the meta becomes counter dudu (aka something really aggressive), then the Jade Elemental shaman can really shine. For now, if someone is interested, I'm leaving the deck like shown above. It's more jade and less elemental, but what can I say, the environment demands it so.
I have a theorycraft idea to add 2x Far Sights just to make the deck draw more. Although tomorrow I will try out the deck and consider the possible changes, I think Elise the Trailblazer and a copy of Jade Chieftain will have to go (or maybe it would be better to cut the servants). Also, because I will be running more card cycle, then Tar Creeper can safely be replaced by Stonehill Defender.
I don't want to make the changes in the deck itself (talking about the page in hearthpwn), because I want to keep the deck as a hybrid one, not just replacing everything with jades.
Well, you said everything very precise. However, I would like to disagree on some points.
Yeah, the druids are a bad MU. Not so much because of the plague, but the ramp and especially the ability to draw bunch of cards. For me the mid-range pala was always a MU with even odds, right now they got a buff and I will admit, that their chances increased. Devolve always stays as an MVP card, because it destroys the internal synergy, If I draw it and my removals on time, of course.
About everything else - those decks have some kind of an advantage, but you can win in many of them, if you play correctly. Like not throwing resources for nothing or overextending. Shamans have Spirit Echo to stand better chances against control decks, the jade package carries us there.
But tbh I'm not going to hide some things. You are right, in this meta elemental or jade/elemental aren't good for climbing the ladder. And that pure jade shaman feels stronger. If shamans still had Ancestral Knowledge, then the things would have been different.
This is the best Jade deck I've come across. Currently on a win streak at rank 8. It has a stupid amount of late game to compete with the control meta. Nzoth and Spirit Echo are the way to go for jade shaman.
Normally this thread was aimed to talk about a specific deck-type (the HYBRID shaman one), the needed cards and what strategies should we form. I'm happy with you guys, the above posting users, but, please, let's continue with the main topic of this thread. I can admit, that I partly contributed to the direction, when I said, that the elementals don't feel that useful atm, but let's keep the thread a one for the jade elemental deck.
DavidC263 has something related to it, but it's more of an N'Zoth deck rather than the hybrid one.
I feel I'm almost finished with this thread, soon I will also be done with the deck. Are_youis right about the state of this deck-type in KoTF, I also posted it in the comment section (in the deck description) few days ago. That's for standard; atm I'm playing this fellow user's deck in wild and I have great success with it.
I haven't tried this out yet but if you want to stick with elementals I've made something that keeps the Aya/WhiteEyes/Nzoth package. I think you need those to keep yourself afloat with all the control decks in the current meta.
Been experimenting with this Jade/ELemental Thrall Evolve deck. I like it. Some hard decisions whether to include Blazecaller or Jade Chieftain, or to go with lighter minions.
Been experimenting with this Jade/ELemental Thrall Evolve deck. I like it. Some hard decisions whether to include Blazecaller or Jade Chieftain, or to go with lighter minions.
ty for the post
but before I give you my opinion and the possible changes, could I ask you, wheter or not this is only a theorycrafted deck or not (have you tried it on the ladder yet?), because i have what to say
Been experimenting with this Jade/ELemental Thrall Evolve deck. I like it. Some hard decisions whether to include Blazecaller or Jade Chieftain, or to go with lighter minions.
ty for the post
but before I give you my opinion and the possible changes, could I ask you, wheter or not this is only a theorycrafted deck or not (have you tried it on the ladder yet?), because i have what to say
Ladder deck, in a few hours climbed to 13 yesterday.
Alright so I'm happy for your success. I don't want to be rude, but imho many cards look super questionable, the deck itself looks absolutely diluted.
Before I continue any further, know, that I welcome originality and creativity in decks overall, however I don't think, that some of the things will work as smooth as you wish they will. Many people in this thread asked about using Thrall, Deathseer in their decks and my personal opinion is No. Why? Because none of the staple cards in the hybrid deck-type work well with the evolve theme. The requirement is to have a wide board (Doppelgangster) or a costly minion, which you can cheat out easily (Nerubian Prophet, Thing from Below). And the elementals don't offer that, almost all of them are clumsy. You play a minion and end the turn. Only Jade Spirit, Fire Fly and maybe Stone Sentinel could fit in a deck with this strategy. The jades at first are worthless tokens, which can be cleared easily. Evolving a 1/1 or a 2/2 token isn't going to change anything. It would be better, if people include minions, which synergise well with the evolve cards, aka they build their decks around it and NOT JUST SLAP THE DK. Inb4 wasn't there a discussion, that Thrall, Deathseer isn't really needed, as if you have a board, you can pretty much win with Bloodlust instead.
As I said my opinion about the DK in elemental decks, I will discuss your one. And imho if you want to make it more competitive, then adjust it better. Choose its path - if you want to make it more aggressive or with late-game. Look at this guy's deck and see how it's oriented to be an aggressive one, which tries to end the game by turn 5 or 6 with 2 copies of Bloodlust. Or you can make it more late-game oriented and the evolve theme will fit better there, as you will gain value out of Bonemare(e.g.) or something else, which is expensive. In your deck you have a strange mix of things, which you tried to sew and to build a deck around them, so once again choose the path of your deck. You would profit more, if you make it more of a token deck, but if you want to have fun, then include big stuff. In a thread about elemental evolve shaman I posted a deck, which could combine some ideas. I don't say it's fully optimized, because it far from it, but the deck looks plausible. Here it is.
Other things I want to point out:
- Prince Taldaram - you do realise, that this card works in combo decks, right? Either you want to copy Aya Blackpaw or another minion, which will come from the evolve (or be played into the evolve), I don't see the logic in this, but this card isn't suited for this deck at all. - The Black Knight - This is one of the cards, which feels awkward in a deck, the first half of which tries to be aggressive and the other half is a full contrast of that. You stick some tech cards to make it better and go away with it. - No card draw? - No Flametongue Totems?
- Prince Taldaram - you do realise, that this card works in combo decks, right? Either you want to copy Aya Blackpaw or another minion, which will come from the evolve (or be played into the evolve), I don't see the logic in this, but this card isn't suited for this deck at all.
Prince Taldaram copies its targets mana cost. So its a nice way to cheat out big minions on an Evolve turn. It has actually worked pretty well for me. Other cards that would compete for the 3-cost slot in my deck would be:
Hex which I miss sometimes but as you mentioned, this deck needs to choose an identity and it tends to be a faster midrange deck, not a control deck.
Hot Spring Guardian I tried it but the lifegain doesn't seem necessary and it seemed to have a low impact.
Tar Creeper I found that the stalling style didnt work well for this deck.
As far as The Black Knight goes, I kind of agree that it can be awkward, but depending on the game it can give a massive tempo swing. So I'm still on the fence about it, but this is a slot that could definitely be changed. My decklist is pretty lacking in single-target removal though so I kind of want to include either this guy or Big Game Hunter, but that could change based on the meta and matchups I face.
Hey, guys, I would like to share a deck with you, which I had huge success and tons of fun in the 4 months of Un'goro:
It's the Jade Elemental Shaman, which started to see play after the nerf of QR. Now, the reason for me making this thread is to make a little reminder, that this deck-type is still strong and, I believe, a specific version of it can deservedly take an honorable place among the competitive decks. While shaman doesn't have the fancy hard removals, which other classes have (Twisting Nether, Brawl, Dragonfire Potion and the priest DK), the biggest advantage of this deck-type is the ability to adapt to the presented meta. If this means tons of aggro, then we can tech in cheap AoEs and taunts. Burn? - bunch of healing. Control decks? - late game value.
About my deck - In the first 2 months of Un'goro I reached rank 4, last month I even went to rank 2. However, because the state of the meta constantly changes and the new one hasn't settled yet, I'm planning on doing some "improvements" and I want to see how the deck will do after I make them. I want to remake it in the context of the new expansion. But I would like to hear out your opinion, what exactly to change, which cards I shouldn't ignore etc.
Cheers.
Pretty good but why no fire elementals?
The deck has been changed and the deck description has been updated. Only 1 card from the KoFT has been included, but I'm just trying to be very cautious on my card choices and to pick the most fitting ones.
That said, I feel I could make another change to the removal part. Don't know, if Doomsayer is needed or should I have a second copy of Lightning Storm, but that's why you are more than welcome to give me your feedback and to make changes of your own. :)
My cents: I would try -2 hex (you have 2 devolve) +1 maelstrom +1 lightning storm or +1 lightning storm +1 volcano, as you wish...
but everytime when i make a change, i think "OK, do I want to top-deck this card in the late game"
don't know of this is a right way to think, but if i follow this pattern, then the answer regarding my case will be volcano
So yeah, druids everywhere. That's why I thought I could cut some removals and make the deck even more minion based, in order to keep the pressure going.
Commentary on some of the cards:
Inb4 Skulking Geist makes the Jade Dudu MUs winable. This doesn't necessarily mean, that I will win every single game against them (still a slightly bad MU), but because the jades cap, this deck can handle theirs before 9 and 10.
Kalimos, Primal Lord - kinda feel guilty to say it, but he doesn't offer that much value right now. Yes, against aggro and mid-range decks he can have a huge impact (to save us from lethal damage or to destroy a whole board), but if you are mainly facing dudu, then you would know, that 8 mana deal 3 damage can't kill those beefy jades. And also 8 mana + this deck doesn't have that many elementals to activate him.
Replacement - Maybe another Jade Chieftain? If we had a better card draw, then I would also consider running Blazecaller, because many times 5 damage is equal to "destroy a minion". I understand, the deck becomes more and more jade rather than elemental hybrid, but if we are going to win against jade dudu, then we have to play at their game.
Why not Stonehill Defender? Meh, I also face other decks and Tar creeper is just a good taunt. Only against control decks (dudu, priest, pala) I have the time to discover something from stonehill. But against aggro and mid-range, I would need better chances to survive. [That's why I run 2x devolve, but, like I said, I'm reconsidering this decision]
Like I said, Leute, this deck has the ability to adapt. And now I'm just trying to find the most optimal build.
I've been spamming for a while, but I'm almost done:
Let's start. It's not the most reliable deck against jade dudu, since they are better at drawing cards and summon their jades faster. I can honestly say, that this does really well against everything else, except burn, because I removed the heal for more pressure, and exodia. If the meta becomes counter dudu (aka something really aggressive), then the Jade Elemental shaman can really shine. For now, if someone is interested, I'm leaving the deck like shown above. It's more jade and less elemental, but what can I say, the environment demands it so.
Thinking on doing something unconventional:
I have a theorycraft idea to add 2x Far Sights just to make the deck draw more. Although tomorrow I will try out the deck and consider the possible changes, I think Elise the Trailblazer and a copy of Jade Chieftain will have to go (or maybe it would be better to cut the servants). Also, because I will be running more card cycle, then Tar Creeper can safely be replaced by Stonehill Defender.
I don't want to make the changes in the deck itself (talking about the page in hearthpwn), because I want to keep the deck as a hybrid one, not just replacing everything with jades.
I dont like elementals, but I am such a great fan of jades and the evolve mechanic...
therefor I present you:
Currently 10-0...
To live is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning in the suffer!
This is the best Jade deck I've come across. Currently on a win streak at rank 8. It has a stupid amount of late game to compete with the control meta. Nzoth and Spirit Echo are the way to go for jade shaman.
Normally this thread was aimed to talk about a specific deck-type (the HYBRID shaman one), the needed cards and what strategies should we form. I'm happy with you guys, the above posting users, but, please, let's continue with the main topic of this thread. I can admit, that I partly contributed to the direction, when I said, that the elementals don't feel that useful atm, but let's keep the thread a one for the jade elemental deck.
DavidC263 has something related to it, but it's more of an N'Zoth deck rather than the hybrid one.
I feel I'm almost finished with this thread, soon I will also be done with the deck. Are_you is right about the state of this deck-type in KoTF, I also posted it in the comment section (in the deck description) few days ago. That's for standard; atm I'm playing this fellow user's deck in wild and I have great success with it.
I strongly recommend you to try out the deck, because it's strong, fun and relatively cheap. My advice is - use Ancestral Knowledge (this is what we are missing in standard), Brann Bronzebeard (tempo Spirit Echo), Flametongue Totem (as usual) and maybe a Skulking Geist (hinders many decks) in your journey.
I haven't tried this out yet but if you want to stick with elementals I've made something that keeps the Aya/WhiteEyes/Nzoth package. I think you need those to keep yourself afloat with all the control decks in the current meta.
Been experimenting with this Jade/ELemental Thrall Evolve deck. I like it. Some hard decisions whether to include Blazecaller or Jade Chieftain, or to go with lighter minions.
- The Black Knight - This is one of the cards, which feels awkward in a deck, the first half of which tries to be aggressive and the other half is a full contrast of that. You stick some tech cards to make it better and go away with it.
- No card draw?
- No Flametongue Totems?
Prince Taldaram copies its targets mana cost. So its a nice way to cheat out big minions on an Evolve turn. It has actually worked pretty well for me. Other cards that would compete for the 3-cost slot in my deck would be:
Hex which I miss sometimes but as you mentioned, this deck needs to choose an identity and it tends to be a faster midrange deck, not a control deck.
Hot Spring Guardian I tried it but the lifegain doesn't seem necessary and it seemed to have a low impact.
Tar Creeper I found that the stalling style didnt work well for this deck.
As far as The Black Knight goes, I kind of agree that it can be awkward, but depending on the game it can give a massive tempo swing. So I'm still on the fence about it, but this is a slot that could definitely be changed. My decklist is pretty lacking in single-target removal though so I kind of want to include either this guy or Big Game Hunter, but that could change based on the meta and matchups I face.
Instead of card draw, we have card generation in the form of Fire Fly and Servant of Kalimos. I've also been playing with 1x Elise the Trailblazer instead of 1 Blazecaller. I think I'm going to take the Blazecaller out entirely because they're too awkward.