Yeah Druid can sometimes tempo you out and Handlock and similar things are kind of hard. BGH will definitely help you I guess (I don't own him personally but else I would give it a spot I guess), and Sap often sees some play on Tempo Rogue ;) I understand the lack of early pressure, that's the deal with including some bigger mid/late game threats ^^ However I don't feel Van Cleef will help in that regard, I already gave him a try and that's kind of inconsistent =/
Then maybe someone else can shed some light on how this deck is so awesome. Never really had any problem with other rogue decks until I tried this one.
Thanks for giving some more explanation Fjaka, even if I already explained a bit at the end of my write up, Alsedexus didn't seem to catch it. You have a really great understanding of my deck and I'm sure it's bringing you some good results in consequence ;)
Hi guys, I'm Spark and Rogue is one of the first classes that I used, and I've been working on this deck since a really long time. I finaly found the tweaks that I like for this deck and definitely recommand you to check it for its niche choices.
April 6th, 2014 : I made 3rd place in the EU Managrind Open 24 Tournament using this deck, see details in a post below
The advantage of this one is that you have the edge over other midrange decks that focuses more on early/mid game thanks to your mid/late game threats, so you'll often win the mirror match if the opponent is playing a standard list ;) It is really good against aggro rushdown decks thanks to our early control plus board presence, but can find some issues against big controls decks if they make it to very late game dealing with all of your threats, however, you'll generally beat them before that happen. It is really versatile and I often find myself playing it when I don't really know about what i'll be facing in the day's meta ;)
Alright man, you have me mostly sold on this. I've been sitting on 2K dust wondering what to use it for. I've been thinking about Mukla for a Miracle Mill style deck (though I don't have Cho) or the legendary Mage. However, Rogue is my hands down favorite class, and based on what I'm reading TBK is required. I'm going to craft him, sleeve up this deck and give it a run as I attempt to level up. I'm currently sitting on rank 14 and am hoping this deck does it for me.
I see you haven't updated it since 4-6 which seems like eons ago. Are their any changes you made from this build?
Well, unlike oldschool rogue decks where you established early board control with mutually buffing cheep minions with this deck you rather use your removal to keep the board clear and put some minor treaths in form of harvest/hoarder/SI7 till the turn 5. Once you get to midgame you just snowball with smiths/Cairne/coldbloded arguses.
What makes it different to play is higher mana curve, which in turn provides less options for combo starters and re-daggering. That means you have to plan your moves atleast 2 turns in advance even doing what seams to be suboptimal play on the turn to enable stronger next turn. Also with the weapon you need to look at your hand and decide weather to go for the face or sit on 2 charges because you won't be able to daggerup next few turns, while with lower curve rogue you generally have spare mana to do so each turn.
Some of the coolest and most efficient combos for wiping opponents board involving smiths/dagger poke/bladeflurry and your board are not always obvious and till you start picking them up you'll be making some sub-optimal trades for sure. Also, Cold blood is a removal too, not only finisher -I removed t4 mountain giant today with only thalanos and loot hoarder on board with perditions battlecry for 1 and cold blood, making it 1+battlecry for 1 trade, but I played thalanos for that specific reason anticipating giant. If not I'd loose game then and there.
But hey, if you had succes with different rogue builds why bother, play what you find most viable atm for you. I have few builds I swap arround, this one is just the one that's been the most effective for me today :D
This is a good explanation, but the thing is, my minions never even live that long to be effective. I frankly don't know how you keep them alive. If I say BS + SI:7 to remove two minions (effective IMO at least, but perhaps I'm wrong) I can be almost sure that he will remove my SI:7 AND play something else that's bigger and badder than I have, turning the tide very quickly. Come turn five and I might be able to play my Spiteful, it's not uncommon that it's the only thing I have out while he has at least 2 minions or a big hitter that I can't handle. It's quite seldom I even have anything out to DoA at all, since they simply have been removed. And I can't refrain from playing minions at all just out of fear of having them removed.
Not saying it's a bad deck and I DO like the rogue, but I get pissed at my self when I don't understand what I'm doing wrong. Ok, some matchups are lost from turn zero due to bad draws but other losses could probably been avoided if I just knew what to look for.
Just now I lost to a hunter and not the rush kind. But what could I do against a Scar with no removals on hand? Next turn came Timber Wolves and Kill command. How should I have handled that? Or how do you handle a shaman that plays early spirit wolves and on turn 6 throws out a Fire Elemental? Should I just ignore his wolves until turn six where an Elementel most likely will come? Or should I burn two or three cards to remove his wolves (which is in reality one card) just to keep early control? What if I don't even have removals on hand, is that an automatic loss? As you see, I just don't understand how everyone else is able to maintain control cause I just get overwhelmed no matter what I do. Attack face? His board outgrows mine. Trade minions? He just plays bigger or more minions than I have. Of cource I can waste two card to remove a Yeti or Taz'dingo but it hardly seems effective. And if I do, my hand will pretty soon be empty. Or maybe that's the way it should be played?
Starting to think it's just not my day. Got a druid to 4 and had lethal x3, he played Deathwing and next turn Alextrasza...
This has been working great for me.. I swapped out the deadly poisons and 1 loot hoarder for Leeroy, Hogger and Edwin VanCleef.. I try to get them to waste their removal on a turn 2-3 Edwin Vancleef and or a turn 6 Hogger. Before pulling out the Big Guns! Thanks for posting this.
That's it Fjaka ;) And like you said, this rule applies for every deck, maybe that this deck requires to pay more attention to this concept due to its versatility ^^
Oh ChiefChujo I find really weird passing out on the Deadly Poisons but well if it works out for you ;)
Hi, recently getting back into rogue and I used to play something very similar to this, except never bothered using the smiths. Going to give it ago tonight. Thanks :)
Hmm it's not comparable to a card draw, which the deck really needs. Anyway I think there'll be some more tweaks to the decks and I may focus a little bit on the deathrattle to have a more decent turn 1 play than Argent Squire (which will clearly die off of Naxx ^^) : Undertaker I need the cards to make my full opinion on this ^^
this is my list/prediction of Deathrattle Tempo Rogue. Currently I'm running Argent Squires until Undertaker is released but the list is already very strong. I'm having a lot of success with it so far. Check the description for a basic write-up about the synergy betweens card choices:
Hmm it's not comparable to a card draw, which the deck really needs. Anyway I think there'll be some more tweaks to the decks and I may focus a little bit on the deathrattle to have a more decent turn 1 play than Argent Squire (which will clearly die off of Naxx ^^) : Undertaker I need the cards to make my full opinion on this ^^
Undertaker may be a solid drop even without a death rattle focus, since tempo rogue runs so many death rattles. It also might be nice to have him be silence bait for other minions. With argent squire being killed by haunted creeper I have to agree that it would be nice to find a stable 1 drop.
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Yes I do up vote everyone who post in my threads as a thanx for taking the time to look at and comment on my post.
Well, guess I have to give up on this deck and toss it. Gonna use those that work.
Yep that's the idea of laddering, finding the deck you do well with and climb to legend =P
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Hey, thanks for the positive feedback.
Yeah Druid can sometimes tempo you out and Handlock and similar things are kind of hard.
BGH will definitely help you I guess (I don't own him personally but else I would give it a spot I guess), and Sap often sees some play on Tempo Rogue ;) I understand the lack of early pressure, that's the deal with including some bigger mid/late game threats ^^ However I don't feel Van Cleef will help in that regard, I already gave him a try and that's kind of inconsistent =/
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Yep Blood Knight is really fine I think ;)
Yeah Cold Blood doesn't implies friendly minions so it's pretty good for BGH =D
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Then maybe someone else can shed some light on how this deck is so awesome. Never really had any problem with other rogue decks until I tried this one.
Thanks for giving some more explanation Fjaka, even if I already explained a bit at the end of my write up, Alsedexus didn't seem to catch it. You have a really great understanding of my deck and I'm sure it's bringing you some good results in consequence ;)
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Alright man, you have me mostly sold on this. I've been sitting on 2K dust wondering what to use it for. I've been thinking about Mukla for a Miracle Mill style deck (though I don't have Cho) or the legendary Mage. However, Rogue is my hands down favorite class, and based on what I'm reading TBK is required. I'm going to craft him, sleeve up this deck and give it a run as I attempt to level up. I'm currently sitting on rank 14 and am hoping this deck does it for me.
I see you haven't updated it since 4-6 which seems like eons ago. Are their any changes you made from this build?
Nope it is still totally the same and doing well at Legends =P
Be sure that any changes would be updated accordingly ;)
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This is a good explanation, but the thing is, my minions never even live that long to be effective. I frankly don't know how you keep them alive. If I say BS + SI:7 to remove two minions (effective IMO at least, but perhaps I'm wrong) I can be almost sure that he will remove my SI:7 AND play something else that's bigger and badder than I have, turning the tide very quickly. Come turn five and I might be able to play my Spiteful, it's not uncommon that it's the only thing I have out while he has at least 2 minions or a big hitter that I can't handle. It's quite seldom I even have anything out to DoA at all, since they simply have been removed. And I can't refrain from playing minions at all just out of fear of having them removed.
Not saying it's a bad deck and I DO like the rogue, but I get pissed at my self when I don't understand what I'm doing wrong. Ok, some matchups are lost from turn zero due to bad draws but other losses could probably been avoided if I just knew what to look for.
Just now I lost to a hunter and not the rush kind. But what could I do against a Scar with no removals on hand? Next turn came Timber Wolves and Kill command. How should I have handled that? Or how do you handle a shaman that plays early spirit wolves and on turn 6 throws out a Fire Elemental? Should I just ignore his wolves until turn six where an Elementel most likely will come? Or should I burn two or three cards to remove his wolves (which is in reality one card) just to keep early control? What if I don't even have removals on hand, is that an automatic loss? As you see, I just don't understand how everyone else is able to maintain control cause I just get overwhelmed no matter what I do. Attack face? His board outgrows mine. Trade minions? He just plays bigger or more minions than I have. Of cource I can waste two card to remove a Yeti or Taz'dingo but it hardly seems effective. And if I do, my hand will pretty soon be empty. Or maybe that's the way it should be played?
Starting to think it's just not my day. Got a druid to 4 and had lethal x3, he played Deathwing and next turn Alextrasza...
This has been working great for me.. I swapped out the deadly poisons and 1 loot hoarder for Leeroy, Hogger and Edwin VanCleef.. I try to get them to waste their removal on a turn 2-3 Edwin Vancleef and or a turn 6 Hogger. Before pulling out the Big Guns! Thanks for posting this.
That's it Fjaka ;) And like you said, this rule applies for every deck, maybe that this deck requires to pay more attention to this concept due to its versatility ^^
Oh ChiefChujo I find really weird passing out on the Deadly Poisons but well if it works out for you ;)
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Hi, recently getting back into rogue and I used to play something very similar to this, except never bothered using the smiths. Going to give it ago tonight. Thanks :)
Yeah they do an amazing job in the mid game, sometimes they are a little it too slow for rush decks but that's the deal ^^
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Updated the deck with Naxxramas release. I think it remains a decent build but not that strong in the current meta, still very pleasant to play ^^
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Don't you think Haunted Creeper is kinda better than loot hoarder in the way that you could trade it then argus later on.?
Hmm it's not comparable to a card draw, which the deck really needs. Anyway I think there'll be some more tweaks to the decks and I may focus a little bit on the deathrattle to have a more decent turn 1 play than Argent Squire (which will clearly die off of Naxx ^^) : Undertaker
I need the cards to make my full opinion on this ^^
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Hey Spark,
this is my list/prediction of Deathrattle Tempo Rogue. Currently I'm running Argent Squires until Undertaker is released but the list is already very strong. I'm having a lot of success with it so far. Check the description for a basic write-up about the synergy betweens card choices:
- senti
Undertaker may be a solid drop even without a death rattle focus, since tempo rogue runs so many death rattles. It also might be nice to have him be silence bait for other minions. With argent squire being killed by haunted creeper I have to agree that it would be nice to find a stable 1 drop.
Yes I do up vote everyone who post in my threads as a thanx for taking the time to look at and comment on my post.
Yep an update will be coming as soon as this wing is released ;)
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Naxxramas Update : http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/89449-spark-tempo-death-naxx
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