So after a first turn undertaker i am sometimes struggling what the best 2nd turn would be:
This should be the hand:
Coin
Mad Scientist
Haunted Creeper
Flare
Leper Gnome OR Webspider
Haunted Creeper
Mad Scientist
Leper gnome +flare
Webspider + flare
Under which circumstances is which play the right?
How do things change if you also have loot hoarder in the mix?
My Theory so far:
Vs hunter: mad scientist!
Against hunter you want to kill his creeper so he cant hound master it. Against hunters other deathrattles it is sometimes not so nice because of trading a 2/2 against a 2/1 is not so nice like trading my webspider against his 2/1
Zoo:
Against void walker flame imp opening 2/2 Scientist is fine too
Against Shaman i prefer 2/2 Scientist too because he might flip the 1/1 totem
Against mage i prefer a 2/1 to force him using his hero power and not playing anything else in his turn.
The 1/2 creeper is usually the right play if you have the option to coin houndmaster the following turn else it normally lacks of agression. Maybe against zoo he could be nice because after dying the 2 1/1 can randomly kill another zoo creature...
flare on turn 2 is like a pass...you're wasting your flares boy
mad scientist or leper gnome+spider is the obvious play
Disagree, Mad scientist is the obvious play, Considering he says your hand is (Coin, Mad Scientist, Haunted Creeper, Flare, leper gnome/webspinner) Or Mad Scientist + Coin + Webspinner, really depends on what your opponent is up to.
Here's the givens in my opinion:
Mad Scientist is a better choice than Haunted Creeper, because you want to get it out before you naturally draw your secrets, so playing it sooner than the creeper gets it killed potentially at least 1 turn sooner, plus the sooner you get free traps out the more of an advantage it is to you and the trap if it's freezing for example helps keep your undertaker safe from a minion attack. It has more attack than creeper letting you maintain board next turn better than the creeper. It is turn 2, you don't have houndmaster in hand so unlikely you'll draw it next turn to coin it out and every turn you have the creeper out before picking up houndmaster reduces your chances of it still being alive for houndmaster/kill command synergy. That's why you'd ideally want to hold on to the creeper instead of holding on to the mad scientist.
Flare is just a poor choice all around turn 2, unless you're playing against a Warrior, practically every other class there's a potential for secrets or shade of naxxramas, conceal, etc. so that rules out simply throwing out the flare with the leper gnome/webspinner
Supposing you had both leper gnome + webspinner and no flare, it's inferior to Mad Scientist simply because the following turn, you'll have 3 mana and 2x 2 mana minions in your hand while you used up your 2x 1 mana minions on turn 2, the better curve is using one of the 2 mana cards leaving you with options for turn 3 of using the 2nd 2 mana card + choice of 1 mana card, or 1 mana card + hero power, etc. unless you do have the coin in which case you could still coin out both the 2 mana minions on turn 3 after playing double 1 mana's turn 2, but that's over extending, you'd be left with only the card you drew on turn 3 in your entire hand, going into turn 4, where AoE start to be playable to destroy your cheap field.
It does depend a bit on what your opponent does, for example if they double innvervate out a sludge belcher their turn 2, you're not going to want to play just a mad scientist because it only brings your undertaker to 3 health. etc. but under normal circumstances Mad Scientist is the solidest play from that hand turn 2, since so few classes have a way to deal 3 damage on turn 3 that couldn't deal it on turn 2, for example Rockbiter/Lightning Bolt/Wrath/Warrior Axe/etc. if you're opponent had any of these in their opening hand, you'd play undertaker turn 1, then their turn 2, they'd use any of the previous mentioned cards to kill it, assuming they don't kill it, the difference between pumping undertaker to a 2/3 or pumping it to a 3/4 is negligable in most situations since they had no answer for it at 2 health plus you'll still be giving it that bonus +1/+1 on your turn 3.
I once lost a game because i 2nd turn the creeper. While my opponent played flame imp. If i would have played lepper gnome instead (and wasting one mana) i could have killed the imp...
It was like this: i begin undertaker, he (zoo) undertaker. I play haunted creeper and kill his undertaker.
He plays imp :(
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Hello all,
I am currently playing undertaker hunter.
So after a first turn undertaker i am sometimes struggling what the best 2nd turn would be:
This should be the hand:
Coin
Mad Scientist
Haunted Creeper
Flare
Leper Gnome OR Webspider
Haunted Creeper
Mad Scientist
Leper gnome +flare
Webspider + flare
Under which circumstances is which play the right?
How do things change if you also have loot hoarder in the mix?
My Theory so far:
Vs hunter: mad scientist!
Against hunter you want to kill his creeper so he cant hound master it. Against hunters other deathrattles it is sometimes not so nice because of trading a 2/2 against a 2/1 is not so nice like trading my webspider against his 2/1
Zoo:
Against void walker flame imp opening 2/2 Scientist is fine too
Against Shaman i prefer 2/2 Scientist too because he might flip the 1/1 totem
Against mage i prefer a 2/1 to force him using his hero power and not playing anything else in his turn.
The 1/2 creeper is usually the right play if you have the option to coin houndmaster the following turn else it normally lacks of agression. Maybe against zoo he could be nice because after dying the 2 1/1 can randomly kill another zoo creature...
What are your tactics for the 2nd turn?
Flare on turn 2 would be a move to make sure you have eagle or kc against the oposing undertaker
flare on turn 2 is like a pass...you're wasting your flares boy
mad scientist or leper gnome+spider is the obvious play
Disagree, Mad scientist is the obvious play, Considering he says your hand is (Coin, Mad Scientist, Haunted Creeper, Flare, leper gnome/webspinner) Or Mad Scientist + Coin + Webspinner, really depends on what your opponent is up to.
Here's the givens in my opinion:
It does depend a bit on what your opponent does, for example if they double innvervate out a sludge belcher their turn 2, you're not going to want to play just a mad scientist because it only brings your undertaker to 3 health. etc. but under normal circumstances Mad Scientist is the solidest play from that hand turn 2, since so few classes have a way to deal 3 damage on turn 3 that couldn't deal it on turn 2, for example Rockbiter/Lightning Bolt/Wrath/Warrior Axe/etc. if you're opponent had any of these in their opening hand, you'd play undertaker turn 1, then their turn 2, they'd use any of the previous mentioned cards to kill it, assuming they don't kill it, the difference between pumping undertaker to a 2/3 or pumping it to a 3/4 is negligable in most situations since they had no answer for it at 2 health plus you'll still be giving it that bonus +1/+1 on your turn 3.
First World problems.
You've probably won this one unless you play Flare.
It is not true that it doesn't matter.
I once lost a game because i 2nd turn the creeper. While my opponent played flame imp. If i would have played lepper gnome instead (and wasting one mana) i could have killed the imp...
It was like this: i begin undertaker, he (zoo) undertaker. I play haunted creeper and kill his undertaker.
He plays imp :(