the juggler v3 [upd. Sept 22nd] - from zero to ...
- Last updated Jun 27, 2015 (Blackrock Launch)
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Wild
- 19 Minions
- 10 Spells
- 1 Weapon
- Deck Type: Ranked Deck
- Deck Archetype: Unknown
- Crafting Cost: 7700
- Dust Needed: Loading Collection
- Created: 9/3/2014 (Naxx Launch)
- user-29918
- Registered User
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- 6
- 16
- 40
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Battle Tag:
N/A
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Region:
EU
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Total Deck Rating
12
Your response to "the juggler"
50k views and 60+ upvotes for a non-legendary, non-caster, non-proplayer deck? Are you guys kidding me? In other words, thx everyone, i had not expected any thing like this. Your feedback / suggestions are highly appreciated!
Quick overview
- golden shaman currently laddering with this rather unique deck
- my personal highest rank: rank 4 midrange shaman in july
- well over 3.500 total wins from ranked play and arena
- free 2 play account, aiming for legend in september
- i am on EU server
Post naxx shaman build
- deck feels very well rounded in play
- high carddraw (esp. when you get cult master to work as well)
- gimmicky deck list and mana curve, looks inconsistent, dont judge, play it
- due to the combos you can pull off its a "jack of all trades" approach
- capeable of a rush like kickstart in the early game
- enough removals, aoe and defense to give you a control like feel
- endless, useful / effective combos
- two high damage finishers
- doesnt fear any matchup
still affordable @4.500 dust (original deck version, see changelog)
Possible winning conditions
- Doomhammer + rockbiter: 10 damage to your opponents face
- Al'Akir + rockbiter OR + flametongue OR + reincarnate: putting Al'Akir behing Sylvanas can be enough to create a situation many decks cant deal with
- Flametongue + reincarnate: Explanation: play reincarnate on flametongue, it changes position to the right side (feature, not bug) and buffs a 3rd minion that turn
- Sylvanas + reincarnate: Grab your opponents card plus keep Sylvanas, that will end a lot of games
Kel'Thuzad + minions: Putting Kel'Thuzad behind a bunch of minions / taunters, suicide them only to get them back - nuff said. See changelog.As Silverbeau pointed out: Kel'Thuzad + reincarnate can also work pretty well. See changelog.
Weaknesses
If it has any weakness, its a tad low on carddraw. Still, i tend to prefer the more solid gnomish inventor over a mana tide totem and over an acolyte of pain (at least when not playing mage or warrior). You might try swapping one of these, if you think your totem play cannot make up for the lack of carddraw. See changelog.
Another issues is consistency. Due to the recent changes (see changelog) and due to the high number of different card choices the deck is a bit more inconsistent than i would like. In one or the other game you might get a hand that doesnt feel too playable, but with enough games played you kinda know what to expect. RNG is always an issue with card based games ofc.
Important card choices
- must haves: Earth Shock, Rockbiter Weapon, Undertaker, Feral Spirit, Gnomish Inventor, Fire Elemental
- combo stuff: Reincarnate, Haunted Creeper, Knife Juggler
- big ones: Doomhammer, Harrison Jones, Sylvanas Windrunner, Al'Akir the Windlord
About my Gnomish Inventor choice: When i started to watch trumps twitch stream, he had a list of arena cards listed after his preference. This small guy was in the top numbers of his list and back then i did not understand why. If you play him long enough, you do. Grants you another card immediately, has a strong body (esp so if buffed by defender of argus), and with a rockbiter he can kill a sludge belcher and survive the assault! In the comments below people rightfully claim that this deck is low on draw power, so you might try if cult master works better for you. I m 50/50 on that call, it kinda depends from game to game.
About Loatheb: If you face a lot of rogues (miracle), druids (turn 9 roar combo) or even hunters (unleash) then its time to let loatheb extend the life of your minions or your own. Only downside being you have to know when to use him, depending on your opponents deck and your own minions on board. If you feel unsure about him, try cairne bloodhoof instead, he s easier to use (but cant protect your minions).
About Sylvanas Windrunner:I sure had to wait ages until i finally crafted her. Earlier i got a bit unlucky with legendary pulls from arena packs on this f2p account, later i made bad decisions about what to craft. With reincarnate coming from naxx, Sylvanas is a must have. Nothing better that grabbin your opponents thick fat firelord or sunwalker, while still keeping your Sylvanas on the board. Only 8 mana for the win!
About Al'Akir the Windlord:One of my winning conditions as well as a great defender when needed. Combine with rockbiters or flametongue for best taste :) Arguably one of the better class legendaries. If you dont have him, i d recommend to add a sunwalker or sludge belcher and not something offensive.
About Kel'Thuzad:Not a 100% sure about this one. If you can get him on the board behind a Sylvanas or some taunters, its a game winning situation if your opponent has no was to silence or remove him immediately. However its arguable, that other legendaries with deathrattle may even add more to this deck. He s not a must have, i m open to suggestions on his slot (cairne? sludge belcher?). See changelog.
Mulligan for dummies (to follow soon tm)
[Changelog] Time to reveal a change to my decklist, this is the latest version i play atm:
- Sept 22nd -1 Loatheb
- Sept 22nd +1 Harrison Jones, reason: Had to try something new :)
- Sept 13th -1 Kel'Thuzad
- Sept 13th -1 Harvest Golem
- Sept 13th +1 Bloodmage Thalnos, reason: Stuck on rank10 way too long, had to adress the card draw issue.
- Sept 13th +1 Cult Master, reason: see above. Thalnos will make up for the loss of deathrattle, while cult master ensures carddraw galore now. Very happy with the result after a few games!
- Sept 9th -1 Lightning Storm
- Sept 9th +1 Nerubian Egg, reason: Buying an "insurance" vs hunters fiery traps. The egg ensures i still have any board presence instead of the wipe that sometimes happens. Makes one or the other hunter hesitate to put his trap, makes it easier to "guess" which trap awaits. Goes well with the jugglers and with reincarnate, if you feel like / need it. Updated the decklist.
You not like this change? Alternative would have been to swap storm for a bloodmage thalnos to address card draw issues, personally i still feel i can do without him. We will see. See changelog.
Future development aka test version: Currently testing card alternatives as follows:
+1 Bloodmage Thalnos, reason: Testing if this solves my slightly too low card draw, undertaker combo. See changelog.- +1 Acidic Swamp Ooze, reason: Hunter's bow / trap combo
- +1 Sludge Belcher, reason: Alternative reincarnate target, undertaker combo
Matchup stats / odds of winning in "the hunters meta"
Currently rank8 (8.5) and rising. Stats of the latest 20 matches (will try and add more stats, but i hardly find time to play):
- W/L rate 55% (11/9)
- vs shaman 1:1
- vs hunter 2:4
- vs warrior 3:0
- vs warlock 1:1
- vs mage 1:0
- vs rogue 0:1
- vs druid 2:1
- vs priest 1:1
Remarks on the matchups: I dont loose matches due to carddraw any more, so the latest changes did as they were supposed to do. In the majority of losses my opener wasnt good and so i couldnt compete in the early game (e.g. turn3 hand: 5-6-6-6), while some games, esp. hunter, were very, very close ones that could well have gone the other way. Thus the hunter stats are a tad misleading.
The juggler does not have to fear any matchup, its rather the carddraw RNG he is afraid of. I cant tell how often i get a high mana starting hand, even though there are only 7 high mana (5+) cards in this deck. Half the deck is 3 mana and below, and still... Can anyone do the math on that perhaps? It feels like you get 10 times as many of the high card into your starting hand, as would be the mathematical average. Those games when you dont get a fair opener are never easy.
I tried to counter this by adding more and more draw, which seems to work around ranks10-8 which i climbed very fast with the enhanced carddraw. Due to the high number of card choices in this deck there is a fair amount of inconsistency, which i also try to counter via decent carddraw. Works for me, at least atm.
Since some of you have reported "the juggler" gave you a winstreak, i sincerely hope you are just better players than i am myself and take our beloved shaman class to victory. For doomhammer!
Discussion / feedback
If you have questions or comments, or want to reveal your results playing this deck, please go ahead, i will try and add to your discussion where ever i can.
regards,
Verker
(aka error37 on EU)
pic below shows initial version 1.0 of "the juggler"
With all the Deathrattles in, why is there no Baron Rivendare ? Its like a reincarnate that affects all your minions + a body on the board
this deck isn't very good. Maybe it's outdated, but it totally sucks now.
Harrison Jones was necessary before the patch but not anymore, 2x Azure Drake is definitely better
Hm... I was doing really good, now I just can't draw anything useful for the life of me. Did everyone drop hunter with the announced nerf? I've gotten so many games where I had a nerubian egg just sitting there all game, think it's a dead card now.
Having some trouble defeating the zoolocks. Any tips?
edit: Nvm, this deck just sucks...
it does have some neat combos, but generally its awful. Even for a shaman deck. It kinda falls between chairs. It's got way too few deathrattle minions to make the undertakers effective.
And there's still not enough card draw. You need luck to make it effective, and decks should not rely on luck for draw.
That deck is much better...
http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/93624-new-shaman-deathrattle-tactics-replacements
Yeah, I should not just have stated "this deck sucks". I'm sorry about that, but it was not actually meant that way. I was only pointing out that I've given the deck up, and wasn't needing any advice against zoo decks.
And there's really no point in arguing against this deck. If people want to play it, let them. I really don't see the problem.
For the record though, I played a lot of games with it. I love playing Shaman, but the mid range pre naxx shaman was getting boring. So I tried this deck for 10 - 15 matchups on ladder. And it didn't work for me. For several reasons:
1. Not enough card-draw with that curve. Even with the addition of a cult master (who can be great, and can be awful). And this isnt really a Cult Master deck.
2. The 2 Undertakers are really just dead cards.
3. It really doesn't do great against the other "meta" decks on the ladder right now. It's not good against hunter nor zoo.
4. It does okay against control decks, but unless you get alot of value for your cult master, your pretty screwed.
I even tried making some changes, but ended up changing the deck completely...
become a zoolock, that is the only way to defeat them.
I am already loving this deck (haven't gotten to play it yet but I'll put some time into it this afternoon) but I have a question about the Al'Akir.
It has been my understanding that he's too slow (turn 8, or 9 + rockbiter) for this season's ladder deck comp, and most 'pro' shaman decks I've been seeing have replaced him with Leeroy. Do you think Al stands up or would you replace him with Leeroy if you owned the card?
Edit: So far this deck rocks. Not making any changes till I get my rank back where I was last season.
I"m terms of kel, being an 8 mana card means your committing a turn to it, and that action in this deck I've found to actually be really bad. at the times I get him, its ether I need to drop something cheaper to secure a win, or there isn't enough board presence to make that good super trade or taunt block for him. I would suggest if you want to keep the same high mana game ending possibility, I would try rag the firelord. otherwise, I'd bring it down to something in the 4 mana range, like a second argus, because that also gives a could trade potential still.
Personly I think Kel is a win more card, than an actual card that makes you win. And the 8 mana for me he just don't seem to be worth it.
I've found, playing other similar Shaman decks that playing Kel before turn 10 (for the + Reincarnate, rarely can they kill two of him) is just throwing him in the discard pile, though often your opponent will spend their whole turn on it so it can work as an expensive stall I guess?
After playing with the deck a bit, I feel like there aren't enough deathrattle guys for the undertakers. Maybe argent squire would be better?
I had quite the success with Harrison Jones. Against Hunters, he gives you some good carddraw, and against anyone else with no weapon he is still a 5/4 that eats a removal or can trade with Hyena.
I replaced Defender of Argus for him because IMO it's not worth taunting two Totems/low mana minions and otherwise its kinda too late in game to use him + a decent player always removes your totems.
Kel'Thuzad is also a good target for your Reincarnate spell. He will return to the board and at the end of the turn he'll summon a Kel'Thuzad, because Kel'Thuzad died this round.
Voilà, your opponent now has two Kel'Thuzads that they must kill, before anything else will really stay dead.
But might put too many minions then the extras will burn
My first 2 rounds were pretty terrible since then im climbing up pretty good.
I switched undertaker and one lightning storm for ooze and argent squire. I found hunter and warrior hardest to play zoo was also pretty hard but well... When you get a board like this it gets pretty funny.
http://i.imgur.com/27GIQQs.jpg
And here a video vs druid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeXFcFFdiG4
I'm no pro either but one of the storms always ended up as dead card for me.
Regarding undertaker I found them a really lackluster atleast in this deck because there are not enough deathrattles.
Argent Squire on the other hand is one of the most annoying one drops
Why not egg?
Hello, I own every card in the deck except for Alakir, what would be the best option to replace him with?
Edit: Didn't read the whole guide before posting... my bad, found your section on replacements and added a belcher, but im wondering if it is worth crafting Alakir? I have just over 1000 dust so I could craft him sometime in the near future what would you recommenced ?